I am in Germany for 7 years now (from 2001 Nov). I was doing my Phd in the first 4 years in a research institute. My job status was wissenschaftliche mitarbeiter and i was paying all the required taxes and rente right from the beginning. My visa status during that period was Aufenthaltsbewilligung. I finished my Phd and currently I work as a wissenschaftliche mitarbeiter in another research institute for the last 3 years. When I went to extend my visa, they changed the status to aufenthaltserlaubnis. In 2007 I went to the 'amt für öffentliche ordnung' to change my visa status to NE thinking that I had been in Germany for more than 5 years and paid above 60 months rente, the declined to change that saying that period during the "Aufenthaltsbewilligung" doesn't count for NE!! Is it right? Somewhere in the forum one of the user has commented that Aufenthaltsbewilligung is also counted for NE provided that I have paid the 60 months rente. It was a comment from 2004, is it still valid? Could anyone sent me an official link where I can find the actual rule. I think the authorities are simply digging up some crap rules to discourage people from going for NE. Thanks in advance

http://www.aufenthaltstitel.de/aufenthaltsg.html#9
http://www.aufenthaltstitel.de/aufenthaltsg.html#9b

Rajesh, you are just another example of foreign who does not know what kind of chances you have. We have seen so many examples here in this website like you. It surprises me that a lot of foreigns do not know what kind of chances they have.

Firstly, you are a scientist. That means, after 01.01.2005 when the new alien law (ZuwG) became effective, there is a special law for scientists that gives people like you an unlimited work and residence permit immediately. The item of this law is called "Niederlassungserlaubnis für Hochqualifizierte".

There are tons of posts here in these forums and tons of information on internet. Please don't be lazy and collect information.

Also, another scientist with nickname rajeshspg has got the same permit under scientist qualification.

Please don't be lazy and search the forums. You might get a very good permit immediately.

Klenze17.

@ Klenze

Happy Newyear(Viel Erfolg!!).

Did you apply for your NE with the new law???..

I hope you get it very soon this year (at least before Spring!!).. Then you can have a great summer break!!


@Rajesh

Just search!! Going for NE is not that easy..you need to have patience and some luck with you :-)
None of these Beamters will offer anything so easily unless we(YOU!!) invest some effort!!

With PhD, you are establishing your career with the help of poor tax payers(The kassier, putz mitarbeiters in LiDl and Aldi are basically funding our so called 'Research' work..). You can get this wonderful title without paying a cent and fly back home or another country to start your professional career..(That is the reason you do not get NE).

Once you start doing research after your PhD, you get money from the same Lidl and Aldi employees but you promise them that you will work on something which benefits them in future..(possibly lessening their burden with your research innovation!!)..here the German government is happy with your approach and recognize your stay as valid and useful :-)...

Best Regards

rajeshpg writes:
@ Klenze

Happy Newyear(Viel Erfolg!!).

Did you apply for your NE with the new law???..

I hope you get it very soon this year (at least before Spring!!).. Then you can have a great summer break!!

Hi Rajesh, nice to hear from you again. I am about to collect my documents. I think I will go to local authorities (Bezirksamt /Bürgeramt /KVR /Ausländerbehörde ) not earlier than next week. I am sure that it will be very problematic to get NE wrt $19 because almost no official is familiar with that. Maybe I will take a professional support (i.e. lawyer). We'll see...

Maybe you remember, that another forum member, havehope, also got NE wrt AufenthG $19. If you know similar people occasionally, let me know because we have no leading case for people working in private sector.

Klenze17.

Thanks a lot to all for the spontaneous reply. Looks like I need to do one more round in the 'amt für öffentliche ordnung'. I just hate that office! :-(

@rajeshspg
I agree that we get a Phd degree with taxpayers money with out us paying any money in return. But if you look from the German governments side its most efficient way to use taxpayers money for the research work we do. As Phd students we are paid less than the normal employees and also most of us has to spend more than the regular 40 hours per week working hours (with out any extra payment for the extra hours we spend) if we wish to finish the doctoral studies in time. Come on, you dont think that the German government is so gracious to allow us to do Phd without any payment, don't you? In that case there wouldn't be some many rules and regulations just for foreigners. We do contribute back to the society in the form of income taxes and also we spent most of the money we earn thereby doing our part in running the economy. So instead of saying we got "wonderful title without paying a cent" I would prefer to say that "we earned that wonderful title".

one Rajesh to another Rajesh
------------

You cannot compare anything in terms of MONEY.. As this is a noble profession and it has to comply a Governmental Scale , you cannot bargain ..If you have opted for Industry Promotion, then you could have asked for more money..Anyway , it was your choice to do your PhD and Germany did not compel you to do this in their country.. We had the option to do also this in India, and naturally, we cannot bargain their.

It lies on your personal interest..I am working in the Government Sector for over 8 years and i know that my salary is half what i can expect in industry..i never complain instead i have a pleasure that my results will be used by my kids and for innovating my idea, i am getting paid by the German Government..I am also more responsible with my job as my salary and my world wide travels are sponsored by all German citizens..If i use it in a horrific way, then i have to hang myself ..in Industry, unless i make my boss rich, i do not have a chance to stay...what ever job i do, whatever results short/long term i produce, my only aim is to make profit for my boss..There i draw a line and better stay with half of my salary and work for something which is based on a NOBLE profession like research and education..

Best Regards

@rajeshspg

I guess everybody has their own reasons for what they do and where they work. So do I, so I guess its not necessary for me to comment on your opinions. And I respect your decisions.

I have some more questions regarding NE
You got your NE based on AufenthG $19. And from what you wrote on your last comments, as you work in the goverment sector the criteria for deciding on your NE status will be different from those with GC if I am right. Again, since you work in government sector I dont think you will be getting salary above 85000/63000 euros (I dont know which is the actual amount) per annum. So when you applied for NE, did you actually finish the 5 years with
aufenthaltserlaubnis or was it Aufenthaltsbewilligung or part of each? Or is it irrelevant if you work in government sector? I also work in the goverment sector, but with 4 years Aufenthaltsbewilligung and 3 years aufenthaltserlaubnis. Someone else in the forum commented that the decision whether to count the time during Aufenthaltsbewilligung also depends on the state (which doesn't make any sense to me!!) where you are. From which state did you apply for the NE? Thanks in advance.

When i got my NE, i did not have 5 years of residency in Germany. I had 2 years of AB and 2 years of AE. I was not a Doctoral student so my case was different. I had a very strong backup from my Professor as i had won lot of research money through EU with my own initiative..In this regard, i could show that i generated jobs....

But if you search my old posts..you would see that it was an easy process for me..As only one 20 minute phone call from my professor(later a letter from him!!) was sufficient to get my NE..

@ Klenze

Recently one of my x-colleague/friend got his NE (from University). He has a PhD and he is working as a team leader in the Uni of Karlsruhe...He also followed his case with a strong letter from his professor..

It is essential that this letter states that your are working in a leading position in a field which is very very important for the German Government..

Wish you good luck..

rajeshspg writes:
@ Klenze

Recently one of my x-colleague/friend got his NE (from University). He has a PhD and he is working as a team leader in the Uni of Karlsruhe...He also followed his case with a strong letter from his professor..

It is essential that this letter states that your are working in a leading position in a field which is very very important for the German Government..

Wish you good luck..

Rajesh, thanks a lot for your information and wishes. The case of you and your friend to get NE $19 is that you work in academic/research institutes which have the advantage of having a professor that can give you a very strong letter. This solves all problems.

However as I stated in my previous post, I need a name/example in private sector, because I am working in private sector and I don't have the advantage of a professor who can give me such kind of letter. I am not in an academic/research institute like you. You and your frıend got NE $19 wrt AufenthG 19.2.1 or 19.2.2. But the only chance for me is the salary (unfortunately) to get NE $19 wrt AufenthG 19.2.3 ( http://www.aufenthaltstitel.de/aufenthaltsg.html#19 ). I can only get this NE from 19.2.3 (63.000 euro annual gross salary income). In other words:

NE §19 for scientists: AufenthG §19 Niederlassungserlaubnis für Hochqualifizierte, 19.2.1 and 19.2.2
NE §19 for private sector (63.600 Euro): AufenthG §19 Niederlassungserlaubnis für Hochqualifizierte, 19.2.3

Up to now there was only one person at Trust7 who got NE $19 from private sector: havehope but he does not come to this site any more. He got NE $19 in the beginning 2005 and I think he was not a GC'ler.

We need, at least I need a person from private sector, not academic/scientific institutes. Both disciplines are completely different, as you know.

But that you constantly follow Trust7 despite your NE $19, is extremely helpful for this community.

Keep in touch my friend.

Klenze17.

@Klenze,

I really hope that you get NE according to §19.3

Regards from your friend

Rajesh

Hi Rajesh,

as of yesterday, I have received the NE w.r.t. §19.2.3 AufenthG ( "Niederlassungserlaubnis für Hochqualifizierte" ) .

Now I am also a member of NE §19 Club!

Klenze17.

Congratulations!!!
NOw I have a question for Rajesh (I've readin this griup for a while and just now I learned that there's maybe a way for to get NE):

@ rajeshspg:

I have read how you've got your NE without having the 63000-yearly-salary nor the 5-year stay conditions because you're in the academic/reserach sector and got funding from EU. My case could be similar so maybe sou can help me out. I work in a national-research center (part of the Helmholtz Association. I've been working for almost 2 1/2 years as wissenchaflicher mitarbeiter and have a contract untill august 2010 (so goes my visa). Just recently I applied for a Helmholtz-Nachwuchsgruppe, which is a quite prestigious award and provides funding for 5 years and up to 1.250.000 euros in order to establish my own research group. I've got the award! I'll be signing the new contract by the end of the month (with a higher TöVD). HOwever, as you know, salaries in research are quite low and I'm not sure yet whether I'll be above the new yearly-salary boundary. If that's not the case, do you think I can apply for NE on the same grounds as you? Where did you apply? I'm in Berlin and ABH here is really -rrrreally something else!-.

You mentioned that you submitted a letter form your prof. I've got the letter from the Helmholtz Association (wich is a state organism) about my being awarded the money for the group. Shoukd I ask also a letter from my intitute? Who would that be? My direct boss, humanresources peoples, the isntitute president? What type of info should be in that letter?

I would greatly appreciate your help about this. And wish you peace and luck.

Ari

@klenze

Congrads man. Atleast now you can breathe easy. Good to know that yours and rajeshspg's efforts on this forum is helping lots of people to get their NE faster.