Greetings!

I have a "friend" that told me that people with a NE §19 (hochqualifizierte) can officially apply for the german citizenship before fulfilling the 6yrs period (which would be great for me, since I am §19).

Has anyone heard about it?

;-) Isa

No. I am also NE §19 since 2009 and applied for citizenship. If you are not married to a German for at least 3 years, there is no way to get the citizenship before 6 years, no matter what qualifications you have.

Citizenship law: http://www.gesetze-im-internet.de/rustag/BJNR005830913.html

I propose to search a little on internet before you ask a question.

Regards,
Klenze17.

Klenze17

Your information is wrong and please dont provide it to others if you are not sure about things.

Maybe Isa got NE19 due to completely different reasons than you.

Isa

Yes citizenship can be recieved even before 6 years, however this is a difficult and exceptional case.

This can happen under §8 StAg if for example this is in national interest (you are a scientist working on topics of national interest, work for a company where travelling is an essential, sportsman, etc). Under §10, there is a mention of citizenship after 6 years in case of exceptional integration used but dont confuse 8 with 10.

§ 8 is a discretionary citizenship clause where many many things can be taken as basis for the citizenship. I got citizenship using this paragraph 8. I got it approximately after 6.5 years, only to get to know that I could have done it earlier too.

Here there is no timelimit of 6 years but as far as I remember, atleast three years are mentioned in the Anwendungsanweisungen (this is sort of an interpretation book of the laws which the officers follow)

The most important thing is a solid application supported by your employer and citing very strong reasons for the application. Also being socially active and speaking good German is an additional benefit.

Some states use this paragraph regularly (Berlin, Hamburg, Koeln, etc) and the others are restrictive (Bayern) are very restrictive with this.

-------------
§8

(1) Ein Ausländer, der rechtmäßig seinen gewöhnlichen Aufenthalt im Inland hat, kann auf seinen Antrag eingebürgert werden, wenn er
1.
handlungsfähig nach Maßgabe von § 80 Abs. 1 des Aufenthaltsgesetzes oder gesetzlich vertreten ist,
2.
weder wegen einer rechtswidrigen Tat zu einer Strafe verurteilt noch gegen ihn auf Grund seiner Schuldunfähigkeit eine Maßregel der Besserung und Sicherung angeordnet worden ist,
3.
eine eigene Wohnung oder ein Unterkommen gefunden hat und
4.
sich und seine Angehörigen zu ernähren imstande ist.
(2) Von den Voraussetzungen des Absatzes 1 Satz 1 Nr. 2 und 4 kann aus Gründen des öffentlichen Interesses oder zur Vermeidung einer besonderen Härte abgesehen werden.

Dear supersid,

I write the things I have experienced. Then I must tell more details.

I have a Niederlassungserlaubnis für Hochqualifizierte wrt AufenthG $19 since Q1/2009 when Arbeitsmigrationssteuerungsgesetz has come effective, and I am one of the few people at Trust7 left as Greencard person, who has followed 2006-2008 period and driven this item per law in detail in many threads. So I know the laws a little. You can search the forums.

I have applied for citizenship a couple of weeks ago in Hamburg and have talked with the officials in all these aspects. He said, there is no difference from which reason the residence permit $19 has been taken (because this is not stated on the passport) and $19 could not have not reduced the citizenship time shorter than 6 years. The only advantage is $19 can give you citizenship in 6 years, providing that you fulfill everything and the official reserves the right to tune it. E.g. you can get exempted from Integration course. The official talked with me and he saw that I could speak German fluently and he said I will not need a Integration course. But there many $19 people who still cannot speak German language but they will get this course. These kinds of tunings or reservations of the official might cause that you may not get even 6 years advantage because these course take time on certain sessions in the year and yes, you come to 7 years or even 8 years again.

However in my case I am since 2005 in Germany, for me it could have been earliest beginning of 2011 (6 years rule) for which I need to prove B2 language test. That was his word. In very high probability I will not do it, because of personal reasons therefore I am waiting for 8 years rule which is B1 language test. Don't ask my why I have applied so late.

Hope this clarifies the things from your side.

Regards,
Klenze17.

Dear Klenze,

I might hurt you but I will still be direct. Every once in a while I meet people like you who believe the case-workers from the Einbürgerungsbehörde/Ausländerbehörde (most of them without a university degree and many of them dont know the rules themselves) blindly without reading the laws. Then they give their half-knowledge to other people with 100% confidence. If they are corrected, they still hold on to their point because it is a matter of ego.

Then they divert the attention by telling their long story and that because they have written some items in a forum or they are active longer in the forum, they are automatically right. Unfortunately, you are one of them and I remember having an argument with you earlier as well.

If you can get me a written document on a letterhead from your EBH saying

"Wir bestätigen hiermit dass es für Einbürgerungsbewerber unter §8 StaG keine Möglichkeit gibt, vor Ablauf von 6 Jahren eingebürgert zu werden."

I will give you 100€. I will then use this document to sue them for wrong information and get 1000€ from them

Read §8 http://www.gesetze-im-internet.de/rustag/__8.html

Now read § 10 http://www.gesetze-im-internet.de/rustag/__10.html

You will notice that §8 has no reference to minimum time-period but §10 does.

I believe there would be no country which would not keep a door open for special cases and § 8 is one of them. I have been naturalized under this para and during the process I got ample insight into how this works. The problem is that most case-workers only know this paragraph half and probably if someone from a Drittland approaches them, they just ignore the fact that you could be highly qualified or of national interest.

-------------------

Coming to the point, irrespective of which § your residence permit has (be it 19, 18), you CAN get naturalized under §8 (Ermessenseinbürgerung/discretionary citizenship). For this an application needs to be filed in the way I described in the message earlier and you need to meet high criterion.

No simple case-worker of the Einbürgerungsbehörde can decide on the application under §8 and needs to forward the application to Innenministerium/Innensenat and they decide based on the merits of the application if the person should be naturalized.

Here it is expected that your citizenship is of national interest - scientist, sportsmen, highly travelling job.

Here having §19 is just an added benefit to show that your presence could be of national interest. In my application, it helped me a lot to make a solid case.

--------------------

Isa - Tell your EBH that you want to apply under §8 and make a solid case. You might get it or not, but atleast you tried.

Hi Supersid,

Thank you for the interesting post.

I have Hochqualifizierte NE since 2 years and
I actually tried about 3 months back and the Lady at the Einbürgerungsamt didn't even look at my application, though I clearly told her that I am applying under Ermesseneinbürgerung §8. She told me to wait till end of this year when I complete 7 years plus she said its a must to get B1 Zertifikat plus Einbürtgerungstest Zertifikat.

You have mentioned that a Solid application is required. Is it a recommendation letter from your Employer or Is it a self written letter by you. Can you please briefly give those points and explain ?

Also, please tell me how much time did it take for you to get EBG ? Did you also submit B1 Zertifikat and Einbürgerungstest Zertifikat ?

Thanks once again.

Once again, dont get fooled by a simple case-worker. He/she can not decide anything in §8 as it goes to Innensenat/Innenministerium. I can only recommend applying even though you might get rejected (which doesnt have any effect as such on your future application)

However, if you have just been living in Germany for 3 years and want to apply under §8, it might be difficult

I think she need to prove that she can speak german. This is mostly B1 or similar. And she need to pass german citizenship test(einbürgerungstest): http://www.deutsch-werden.de/einbuergerungstest

This online quiz is like real test with 33 random questions. She has 60 minutes to answer that 33 questions. I did it and it is easy(of course if you speak german).

When I applied for the citizenship in 2009 I had been living in Germany only for 3 years. I did it so under the §8 and discretionary naturalization of highly-qualified scientist engaged with the indispensable research and teaching. It perhaps means that no one else does or possbily can replace you when it comes to that kind of research and teaching. I got an honorary naturalization without any issues.

roundtheclock,

What field are you in? And in which state did you file for naturalization? Thanks!


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roundtheclock said:


I had been living in Germany only for 3 years. I did it so under the §8 and discretionary naturalization of highly-qualified scientist engaged with the indispensable research and teaching.

@ Klenze

Based on the example put by another person, Roundtheclock, do you notice that citizenship is possible earlier than 6 years?

@ Roundtheclock - Could you please drop an email at gdizmunich@gmail.com? I would like to get in touch with you to pursue similar cases of highly-qualified scientists/researchers so that they can be naturalized easier?

Thanks
Siddharth

Hi,

 I have applied after 8 years stay in DE under §8 (Ermessenseinbürgerung/discretionary citizenship) as I live in Freistaat Bayern (München) , reason

•  they will not count 2 years for my Doctorate from medicine faculty in Heidelberg for §10

I have got stong letter from my employer, german certificates. Problem is because in research we have short contracts as it depends on grants. Regirung von Oberbayern had asked me to provide Unterhaltungsfähigkeit beweis, I gave them letter from my professor about at the end of current contract my contract will get extended further for one year and with availibility of planned grants it will get extended further.

I really do not know if this will suffice the need of Regirung von Oberbayern ??