Hello
I am Srinivas working for an automotive company. Coming to my self : I came to germany in Mar’03.completed masters from uni-karlsruhe in Aug’06, then I started my carrier from Nov’06.
I read some posts in this forum. I just need some clarification for what I read and understood.

1. to my understanding I am eligible for Niederlassungserlaubnis only after 2.9 years from now.
21 m(41 Months/2 –student status) + 6 months job (nov’06 to apr’07) + 33 m (to wait). Or

2. Student period will be considered fully as 41 months.
41m (student status) + 6 months job (Nov ’06 to apr’07) + 13 m (to wait).
Is there any suggations for your side, as I am new to job field as compared to you all.

Thank you
Srinu78

Who said student time will be considered for NE?

There is a possibility to get NE-EG not NE if you have paid Rente during your student time.

The earliest you can apply depends on how many months you have paid your Rentenversicherung.

Hi

Thank you raj for your reply.
i know only NE (Permanent Residence), what is NE-EG. where can i get info about NE-EG.
i paid around 30 months of rentalversicherung when i was student with my HIWI job in UNI.
How many months we should pay RV to get NE-EG ?

thank you
sinu

http://trust7faq.wik.is/Visa/Daueraufenthalt_EG

hi
i read about D-EG. its mentioned like this
"60 months pension payment is required". is it immeterial wheather its paid in job period or in student period.
and for both "Should have stayed in Germany for atleast 60 consecutive months".
my qus is : according to you in both cases my student period will not be considered.

sinu78

Hello Srinu,

If you go for normal NE, you will be eligible only in Nov 2011.

Your best bet is to go for D-EG where 60 months rentenversicherung is the criteria. Doesnt matter if you have paid with normal work or student work.

Hello Raj

Thank you very much for your reply. now i got your point.
but some more qus:

1. i paid around 3 yrs of RV in my student period, but not continuosly (brake is there around 1 to 3 months. i think i had this break 2-3 times).
so is this is considered for D-EG. (or should have continuous period)

2. what about in job period (we should pay RV continuosly or its no problem if we have break of 1-2 months.like this max how many times are allowed).

thank you raj once again

srinu

No, it does not have to be continuous. Totally 60 is the criteria.

Anyway according to my estimate you have still 2 more years to go before you can think of applying, so why break ur head now.

Hello friends,
Hope my query will be somewhat related to this thread. If not pls sorry for that. I would like to know whether am eligible to apply for NE_Daueraufenthalt_EG in august 07/april 08.
About me:
1. I am living in germany since 5 yrs and 7 months. 3 yrs as student and 2 yrs and 7 months as employee. (My current visa is valid until sept 07.
2. I have paid my Rentenversicherungsgeld for 57 months so far. (26 months as student and 31 months as employee).
My query:
A. Whether i am eligible to apply for NE_Daueraufenthalt_EG in august 07 as per my completion of 60 month RentenV or in april 08 as per my legal living status (18 months(36 M student) + 42 M employee) ?
B. or am not at all eligible for those cases which i mentioned above ?.

Thanks in advance and Have a nice day !,
regards,
kodam2

Thank you raj

Now i understood when iam allowed to apply for D-NE.

Thank you once again.

All the best
bye

In my understanding it is april 2008 since u have to fulfill both requirements - 60 months of Rentversicherung payments and 60 month of appropriate legal staying in the country plus prove u have enough funds to support urself. Still helps though since u can get NE_Daueraufenhalt 1.5 year earlier than regular NE.

The question I have is what is considered as 'stable and sufficient resources to maintain yourself' - only current employment with umbefristet contract? We already discussed what is the likely scenario if someone is unemployed and applies for regular NE, looks like it is the same case for NE_Daueraufenhalt or is there any differences?

Thanks kmoro, I hope so too in april 2008. Any more ideas/inputs ?.

kodam2

Srinu78 wrote:
1. to my understanding I am eligible for Niederlassungserlaubnis only after 2.9 years from now.
21 m(41 Months/2 –student status) + 6 months job (nov’06 to apr’07) + 33 m (to wait). Or

2. Student period will be considered fully as 41 months.
41m (student status) + 6 months job (Nov ’06 to apr’07) + 13 m (to wait).
Is there any suggations for your side, as I am new to job field as compared to you all.

Hi Srinivas,

according to German Laws, AufenthG $16 cannot be used to get NE. In other words, the time when you have a residence permit for education, is never considered to meet the requirements for NE. Even if you have worked in a company (no matter how, Praktikum, Diplomarbeit etc) and paid pension funds (Rente).

Proof.
1. The Lawyer says that the works while you are having a residence permit wrt. education cannot be considered for NE:
https://www.123recht.net/fea/Anspruch-auf-Niederlassungserlaubnis-und-ARB-180__f3696.html
2. Thread in (http://info4alien.de). The officials at Ausländerbehörde (Foreign Office) also post messages, so it is a very objective forum:
http://www.info4alien.de/cgi-bin/forum/YaBB.cgi?num=1161030712
3. http://www.verein-rechtverstaendlich.de/AufenhaltzumStudiumWeb2007.ppt :
Solange eine Aufenthaltserlaubnis zu Studienzwecken besteht, wird eine Niederlassungserlaubnis nicht erteilt werden.
4. The law (AufenthG §16):
http://www.aufenthaltstitel.deaufenthaltsg.html#16

Since Nov'06 you have worked 6 months. That means you must work at least 54 months. This gives you 60/42 = 4,5 years.

raj wrote
There is a possibility to get NE-EG not NE if you have paid Rente during your student time.

No. NE-EG is also a NE. Even if you pay pension fund (Rente), student period is never considered. Proof is in the links above.

kodam2 wrote:
Hope my query will be somewhat related to this thread. If not pls sorry for that. I would like to know whether am eligible to apply for NE_Daueraufenthalt_EG in august 07/april 08.
About me:
1. I am living in germany since 5 yrs and 7 months. 3 yrs as student and 2 yrs and 7 months as employee. (My current visa is valid until sept 07.
2. I have paid my Rentenversicherungsgeld for 57 months so far. (26 months as student and 31 months as employee).
My query:
A. Whether i am eligible to apply for NE_Daueraufenthalt_EG in august 07 as per my completion of 60 month RentenV or in april 08 as per my legal living status (18 months(36 M student) + 42 M employee) ?

No. See above. Since you have worked only 2 years and 7 months, in which you were no student, you must work at least 2 years and 3 months in Germany to be eligible for NE. See above. Paying for pension fund does not help, because you were a student that time.

You guys are asking the same questions again and again. I resummarize for you:

1. The times are not considered for NE, as long as you have residence permit bound to education. No matter how many pension you have paid.
2. Requirement to get NE is to show that you have worked 60 months. That means, 60 salary slips. During this time you must never be a student.
3. 60 months must be done at least in 5 years. You can work 4 years, you can be 1 year jobless, then you can work 1 year more. In this case you are eligible for NE in 6th year according to my example above.
4. Foreign Office (Ausländerbehörde) do not care how many different companies you have worked. You can work 10 different companies in which you have worked 6 months. This satisfies again 60 monthly salary slips.
5. That the job contract must be unlimited, is not true. However we have seen in the past that sometimes the officials object to give a NE, when an applicant has a limited job contract. In this case, I strongly recommend the said person to contact a lawyer.

Klenze17.

Hi
A small correction. It is true that student times will not be counted for NE. (Regardless of the pension payment..)
BUT.. the new planned law which should come into effect approx. in the next 6 months.(if all goes well) regulates the NE-EG in such a way that student times are counted to half.

http://dip.bundestag.de/btd/16/050/1605065.pdf
p. 17 (Top of the page.. N. 3)

Regards,

Lacrima

Thanks for the new information. I have some related question.
1…According to some previous posts. Student time for NE or NE-EG is not counted in Bayern and BW only. Is it counted in other states (half or with rente) ?
2….Any state where it is counted for sure ?

3….Is it counted for the Citizenship required legal stay period of 7 years ?
(half, full, state dependent)

If yes; should a person be more interested applying for Citizenship rather then NE or NE-EG.
If studied 3 yeas (with no Rente) and worked 4 years. ?

Regards
Kirn

Kirn wrote:
Thanks for the new information.

This information is not new. It is law and you could also have found it.

1…According to some previous posts. Student time for NE or NE-EG is not counted in Bayern and BW only. Is it counted in other states (half or with rente) ?

No.

2….Any state where it is counted for sure ?

No. Look, this is German Law and is nationwide.

3….Is it counted for the Citizenship required legal stay period of 7 years ?
(half, full, state dependent)

No.:
http://www.info4alien.de//einbuergerung/themen/anspruch.htm
"Besitz einer Aufenthaltserlaubnis, die einen dauernden Aufenthalt ermöglicht, oder Niederlassungserlaubnis, bzw. die Eigenschaft als freizügigkeitsberechtigter Unionsbürger (wobei eine Aufenthaltserlaubnis nach den §§ 16, 17, 22, 23 Abs. 1, §§ 23a, 24 und 25 Abs. 3 und 4 des Aufenthaltsgesetzes aber nicht ausreicht)."

If yes; should a person be more interested applying for Citizenship rather then NE or NE-EG.
If studied 3 yeas (with no Rente) and worked 4 years. ?

Not applicable, because the answer of your previous question is a NO.

Kirn, and the other students! Before asking a question, read the "Friendly" Forums! Google on internet! Show your hard-working manner also in your personal interests!

Klenze17.

Sorry Klenze to contradict you again partially.. Your are right about the AufenthG §16 being not enough for the citizenship. But a person could have such a status before and apply for the citizenship by holding a residence permit with different § (Students who find a job after studies and change their residence status.)

Now answers to Kirn's questions..
1-) There is no state difference for that. You are confusing it with the citizenship. Student times are not counted for NE. Nowhere in Germany, regardless of the pension payment. But the new planned law will allow it to be counted to half. BUT it is not law YET.. (See my previous post)

2-) None
3-) For citizenship, it is a different story. In the states except BW and Bayern. It is counted as full amount for citizenship. But at the time of the application, you should NOT be holding a student residence permit and fulfill all other requirements.
This difference is because of the different interpretations of the states regarding the law paragraph stating the "Gewöhnlicher/Rechtmäßiger Aufenthalt"
http://www.info4alien.de/einbuergerung/themen/rm_aufenthalt.htm

4-) Well, it is a personal choice. If you studied 3 years and worked 4 years and now holding a normal work/residence permit(not for studying) and living not in BW and Bayern and eager to give up your current citizenship, then applying for the German citizenship might be a wise thing to do. BUT as I said, it is a personal choice. Some people do not like the idea of giving up their current citizenship, for some, NE is good enough.. it really depends..

Regards,

Lacrima

3. 60 months must be done at least in 5 years. You can work 4 years, you can be 1 year jobless, then you can work 1 year more. In this case you are eligible for NE in 6th year according to my example above.

klenze17, the person receives ALG I after 4 years of work so Renteversicherung payments are made by Arbeitsamt for one year. I newer saw the requirement that you have to work 5 year, 60 months of Rentversicherung payments is the case, so I believe you don't have to work for one more year before applying for NE if you found a new job after one year of being on ALG I after 4 years of work. The guy who got NE while being on ALG I proves this case, so that's another contradiction.

lacrima is right, if you read the Richtlinie 2003/109/EG about Dauerhaft_NE it is clear that the person who studied before finding a job and swithching from §16 to §18 can count half of study time in residence requirements and all the time he or she payed Rentversicherung to those 60 months. The only thing that according to the link provided by lacrima it is not enforced yet but will be soon hopefully in 6 months. Note that the inverse is not applicable - if i work for 4 years, go to school for 2 years and pay Rentfersicherung for 1 year during studies I can't use this since this Richtlinie is not applicable to students, but if i find a job after completion those studies i can apply for Dauerhaft_NE right away assuming the richtlinie is fully enforced.

Thanks lacrima,
Its mean in States other than Bayern or BW, one can apply for Citizenship with 6 years as student and 1 year working while holding a working status at the time of applying.
But if this person is in Bayern or BW, he has to wait for another 6 more years.
If my assumed situation is valid. Ohh, It is big difference. Isn’t it ?
Regards
Kimn

"Its mean in States other than Bayern or BW, one can apply for Citizenship with 6 years as student and 1 year working while holding a working status at the time of applying."
CORRECT !

"But if this person is in Bayern or BW, he has to wait for another 6 more years."
CORRECT !


"If my assumed situation is valid. Ohh, It is big difference. Isn’t it ?"

Yes, it is and that is why it might make sense to reallocate to another state in such a situation, if you want to apply for citizenship. If you get the German citizenship in another state, you are not "less" German and can reside in BW and Bayern afterwards anyway. I find this regulation of BW and Bayern really stupid. It has also smt to do with the snobbishness of the south German states. They see themselves privileged and as another country in Germany.
Because of this reason, some politicians already fear a "Einbürgerungstourismus" and try to make the regulations uniform all over Germany.
http://www.aufenthaltstitel.de/zuwg/1178.html

Regards,

Lacrima

Thanks a lot lacrima,
This idea is not bad to look for a new job in other states when citizenship qualification time would be near. It is little funny too. But I would prefer to go for this.

Things are clear. Now, I assume that there is no doubt that full student time would be counted in other states.
As this law is nationwide different, I wander, there might be a possibility that a cirtain Ausländerbehörde in other states could also refuse to consider the student time. ??
Some times persons sitting there, following all rules, can implements in a way they want.
Regards
Asad