Has anybody seen this VwVs from http://www.aufenthaltstitel.de/beschverfv.html ? They look diferent from the ones before and there is no mention about IT specialists. Am I missing something?

there are 2 BeschV. Inland und Ausland.
Your is Inland, and for us not important.

Ausland is here with IT
http://www.aufenthaltstitel.de/beschv.html

but aren't we inland? What about the ausland VwV? was it voted/adopted?

true we are in land but it is not the question.
It is just that they decided to put few rules in that BeschV. Meaning both BeschV are valid and both are valid for everybody, but only Ausl says that GC will be used as unbefristete zustimung auf Aufenthaltstitel.

It is just question where it is written. It could also be written in Gesetz, but it is not.

It is accepted on 5.11.04. and valid from 1.1.05

Hello All GCs,
Last week, I went to the Ausländerbehörde to ask about my situation regarding the new law. I told them that I am a GC since May 2001 so I am here already for 3.5 years and my contract and Arbeitserlaubnis finish at the end of the 5 years and maybe my company will not extend my contract because I work in a research institute where 5 years is the max stay for engineers. What I wanted to know from the Ausländeramt was to answer 2 questions:
1. After working 5 years in Germany, do I need a job / running contract to get the PR , or i will get it even if my job finished by the end of the 5 years?

2. As a Wissenschaftlicher Mitarbeiter, can i get the PR directly after 01.01.2005 as a Hochqualifiziert even my salary is less than 80 k euro?

The answer of the Ausländerbehörde was: We DO NOT know anything!!! So no one there was able to answer my 2 questions.
I think this is very strange to happen, until when should we wait with no info about our future??? Is this fair??
Regards,
Zash

zash, zash
I think I told 100 times they don't know anything.
I think we know much more than they do.

so than renewing the Wp/RP should be just a formality than or? What should I understand out of this VwV? I mean it is writen black on white that we can renew our working permits how many times we want..or? Is it specified somewhere for how much longer will we get the new ones? 2 years?

chira,
after 5 years you can ask for PR if you want.
off course if you do not want you could ask 2 years.

I don't trust this PR stuff. I don't believe it will be easy to get so I concentrate more on renewing the work permit with another non permanent RP/WP. For me is also not very important coze I come from Romania and Romania should join EU in 2007..so another year would mean for me PR in anycase. Would be nice to get it after this 5 years but I am not very confident about that.

"Romania should join EU in 2007"

That does not necessarily mean a PR for a Romanian citizen.. do you think newly joined 10 EU countries' workforce are now able to freely move in EU. NO ! There are so called transition regulations ! and in Germany, citizens of the newly joined EU members will still need workpermit for the next seven years. If germany thinks that it is necessary, then they can even prolong this period.. (and god knows, how many years of transition period will be decided for Romania and Bulgaria which are "supposedly" joining EU in 2007)

just for your information.. so you can base your plans on real facts..

Regards

Lacrima

Actually being from new EU country is an advantage ! The colleauge(s) of mine coming from Slovakia have already got unlimited work permit. The procedure took two weeks. There is some kind of regulation which says if you are coming from new EU country and have worked one year for the same company, you get unlimited WP. But I am not sure is this only valid also for Romania and Bulgaria.

Lacrima, I base my plans on real facts. The negotiated limit for work permits does not apply for people that live in an EU country for at least 18 months before Romanias EU accession. This is what heapend with that friend from slovakia that was mentioned in the post above mine. So if you live in an EU country with more than 18 months before the date when romania or bulgaria joins than you get a PR imidiatly. I have read this in the official negotiation papers from EU. I also asked 2 persons from EU HQ from Bruxeles and they both told me the same. One of them was actualy the one that wrote the document. I also found out that the same was tru or is true for the first 10 countrys that are already in. So yes I know what I am talking about and I hope this will be a good news for all of us that come from Romania and Bulgaria.

Hey, that's cool! You sure have gone to the bottom of it :-) Very impressive!

Would you care to share the EU papers you mentioned with us?

Thanks in advance.

Flado
(from Bulgaria)

Dear Friends,DvD

Can you please explain(in english the new rtequirements (acc. to this new BeschverfV).I have only seen this doc. in german.So please explain the rules to get PR / work permit as per the law passed on 5th Nov.

Many thanks

vchira, if person is from new EU and worked here for more than a year - he/she gets unlimited work permit, but not PR - you just get EU residence permit - forgot how it's called in German (maybe EU Aufenthalterlaubnis?) - it takes only 5 minutes to get. You can get PR after 5 years or just keep extending EU residence permit.

lacrima, old EU countries can choose how long they want to protect their labour market - up to MAX 7 years (2+3+2). Germany and Austria at the moment decided that they impose limitations for 2 years but this decision is not final (unlike in case with other old EU countries) and most likely after two years it will be extended for 3 more years. However 7 years is maximum.

@vchira

I was talkin about newcomer Romanians..

ok ok.. I know that you can get a EU-Aufenthaltserlaubnis, if you are already in Germany for a year. BUT only some individuals will take advantage of it, not all citizens of new EU countries... what I said is still valid.. there is indeed now.. kind of second class EU Citizen and first class EU citizen in EU.. guys dont get angry, I am telling the facts.. I personally wish that all of you get PR (including me).. I will also get it before 2007 after 4 years of working.. and my country is not in EU..

All the best..

Lacrima

You get EU-Aufenthaltserlaubnis immediately - it's only formality, however you can get unlimited Arbeitserlaubnis only after 12 months of working in Germany and your relatives (that are together with you in Germany) get it only after 18 months.

there are no requirements in BeschV.
they only state that GC is considered as a permanent agreement for RP.

so no conditions in BeschV.
of course if one looses job he needs lot's of luck.

@vchira
funny but PR is easier to get than RP.
problem with PR prolongation is that law says:
Visum CAN BE PROLONGED,
so they must not do it and no court can help you.
On the other hand law says
One HAS RIGHT to PR.
so they can refuse to give it but if you sue them on court then you have to get your PR.

But usually there is no problem in getting both if you have job

I am not sure Romania will enter EU in 2007, and nobody can be. It is uncertain. It could also happened in 2009. I know it because Croatia is in the same group.

So my advice to you:
PR after 5 years is much more certain option than RP or Romania Eintritt.
Or is it German that makes you worry?
I think language will be important for newcomers, not us.

Cratia is not in same group coze Croatia just started negotations and Romania and Bulgaria has already finished them. I would like croatia in as soon as possible coze it diserves it. I speak german preaty good so no fear of that too...I just hopw that when romania will join EU I won't get all that bullshit from ausländeramt anymore...

When did you come to D?
Cose if you came in 2000 then next year you'll have PR. Only if you came 2002, could happend that Romania enters EU before your PR.
For Croatia, it is quite possible that there will be one termin for all three lands because it is much easier that way for EU. So it can happend that someone waits others so that all enter EU in 2007, or 8 or 9 but it is all uncertain.
It is not sure will they join EU together and
it is not sure what year will it happend.

So your Deutschland entrance year + 5 years = PR
is much much more certain than everything else.

I am here since 2000 so theorethicaly next year I should get the PR but I am not very sure about that...with how many weeks before must/can one apply for the PR? and how does it work I mean if I don't get the PR I still get a new RP isn't it?

Usualy 1-2 months before RP expires you ask for extension. So will probably be with PR also.
I supose one can ask for it few months earlier and it will be given with some future begining date. But even if you have to wait for full 5 years, you'll get extension for maybe 2 years, and few months later, when 5 years are complete you'll ask for PR and get it.
So it is in your case 2005, and if you wait Romania entrance it is 2007, when you reach PR.
What is better?

It's better everything that's faster...and more reliable..ausländeramt is not...