Hi all,

I want your honest answers and reasons why you wish to settle in this country.

How many of you think,

- settling in Germany permanently is good for you economically and socially?
- you can stand strong in a nation where racism is socially accepted?
- you can have friendly neighbours and some good friends who can share joy of life with you?
- prospects of your children in this country are good?
- you will be ready to face legal obligations if necessary to defend yourself from the perpetrators, with the langauge you find difficult to understand and learn.
- you can invite your beloved ones to this country easily for regular visits and if necessary in urgent cases
- at any stage of your life in Germany you will not be regarded as a foreigner even after contributing so much for this country and probably holding a passport too.
- it will be easy and convinient for you to integrate socially
- the social benefits from the Government will be alive and your social contributions will not disappear

I will be eagerly waiting for your answers!

thanking you!
babloo

These are known issues with Germany. If you search the previous postings in trust7 forums, you can find lots of answers about the questions you ask. Honestly speaking being in Germany since 3 years and seeing how the community and commonsense of people cycling in an obstinate and stubborn way with unwritten rules and laws in minds, i already gave up to tell/explain/discuss things. Because that kind of behaviour only costs your nerves and grey hairs.

Keeping distance, avoiding polemics and discussions about some 'subjects' help a lot. And if you want to leave the country, first try to get the most use of it, plan your exit securely and in a painless way.

We are not here in Germany as GC holders to change the mind of people. That is valid for at least myself. I gave up. Do not forget to prepare yourself a good Jack Daniels-Coke with ice and enjoy it of course.

- "settling in Germany permanently is good for you economically and socially?", this always depends on the economy of the country you want to settle in, no matter how good is the people.
- "you can stand strong in a nation where racism is socially accepted?", racism exists everywhere, you just have to make your marks and as said, avoid all the things that could get you into some kinda trouble.
- "you can have friendly neighbours and some good friends who can share joy of life with you?", if you think about "German friends" then already have some (Detlef and a good bunch of other) and I'm really pleased of that. But for that, you should try to get in touch with them, when you just keep yourself in your "community" then don't tell others don't like you.
- "prospects of your children in this country are good?", looks ok to me, even if they will have to struggle a lot, but life is just a serie of struggles, ain't it? And in every country you will go, you will have to face that. I dunno how you look, but for people like me who are black, we really know what it is.
- "you will be ready to face legal obligations if necessary to defend yourself from the perpetrators, with the langauge you find difficult to understand and learn", already did and as my wife told me some days ago, German is not that difficult to learn or understand, you just have to want to learn it to be able to and you have to invest yourself in it (not financially speaking).
- "you can invite your beloved ones to this country easily for regular visits and if necessary in urgent cases", already did and still do, just stopped at the moment because my visa is no more that long enough so I'm waiting for better days for that.
- "at any stage of your life in Germany you will not be regarded as a foreigner even after contributing so much for this country and probably holding a passport too", as far as you're not in your native country, you will always be a foreigner, even if holding a passport of the coutry you're in. Even in my country, you will be considered like that, after having made a lot of time living there, but this doesn't make my country an awfull place to live, I would recommand it to you surely if you want.
- "it will be easy and convinient for you to integrate socially", depends on if you want but you have to take care that Germany is starting to get foreigners and trying to live with them. Stop comparing it with others like USA, France, UK and other countries. They deal with foreigners since centuries and they had time to get them in the society (think about what black people went thru in the USA since the time of slavery and what they had to do to get where they are now), you can't want Germany to be open minded in a couple of years, they will surely, as the old, stubborn generation is passing away, but you won't be in it, my kids won't be in it, maybe some generations after then but all is a matter of the future, if you leave because you can't, when, how and with whom to you want them to change their mind?
- "the social benefits from the Government will be alive and your social contributions will not disappear", you will have to deal with that, as it's necessary in my point of view.

D.

Well..I have always seen this discussed in this forum . I had read the bad experiences many people had. Let me tell you what I think..

- settling in Germany permanently is good for you economically and socially?

So far it is good. Economically & socially. It all depends on your perspective. Economical benefits is of course there even though it's less compared to the states. But you have more job security here. Even if for an argument we could say that the social security in Germany is not as good as before..it's better compared to other countries.

- you can stand strong in a nation where racism is socially accepted?

I do not agree to this. Racism is there in every country. I come from the south of India. Is there no racism in India? India is so diverse that people from one region do not really accept people from another region. So I guess it's a personal thing whether someone likes foreigners or not. Of course I agree that Germany has a bad history on this and there are still some people who don't like us. But not everyone. But it's there in UK and US. As DVD says, just live your life and don not look for trouble.

- Prospects of your children in this country are good?
Depends on how you bring then up. Like DVD says, they have to struggle a lot. Well that’s today’s world. To be successful they have to struggle anyway. Nothing comes in an easy package. They have to struggle even if they are in their home country. I know a lot of people who are from India whose Kids are doing good.

- you will be ready to face legal obligations if necessary to defend yourself from the perpetrators, with the language you find difficult to understand and learn.

Well..learning the language is our headache. You can be fluent in German if you really wish you. It's just that we are too lazy to learn it. At least I know abut me!!!. There are foreigners who speak fluent German.
Of course you may not speak like the natives. But that would be same if you are in UK or US. You will most probably have your accent no matter which language you speak.

- you can invite your beloved ones to this country easily for regular visits and if necessary in urgent cases

Already doing this, there is no big deal abut it.

- at any stage of your life in Germany you will not be regarded as a foreigner even after contributing so much for this country and probably holding a passport too.

You are a foreigner in any country other than your home country no matter which passport you hold. This is something you have to compromise.

- It will be easy and convenient for you to integrate socially

Integrating in any society is not that easy. Again it depends on your perspective. Let me tell you, I have a lot of German friends and they are true friends who were there for me when I needed them. It all depends on how you treat them. You should always think abt the cultural differences. Just don't try to judge the people based on our culture. Judge them based on their culture.

- The social benefits from the Government will be alive and your social contributions will not disappear

I don't think it's going to disappear. There may be some reductions but I don't think it will just disappear.

So that was it. This was my personal opinion and I don't want to have an argument regarding this. It's just my opinion and it will remain so. :-))

Regards
Faisal

>You are a foreigner in any country other than your >home country no matter which passport you hold. This >is something you have to compromise.

I have a name and surname. Once i heard in the place where i was living before German neighbours talking to each other about other people who are living in the same place: They call themselves like Herr Müller, Frau Zicke etc. But when it comes to me I am not Herr X or Frau Y, i am just fuc.... "Ausländer in zweite Stock... "

Speak for yourself.
Do not tell people things like
"you have to compromise"

One More question,

How many times are we going to discuss the same topic?

I agree with Indian..
We discussed this topic already "n" times. Some guys posting such comments are deeply in Culture Shock and frustrated because of that and they just blame the new culture that they are living in. People having nice time in Germany usually do not complain in Web Forums. That's why we only see complaints around..
Like Nobody said, Life is already a struggle, challenge. It is not easy.. you always need to overcome problems. That is the same also in your home country. Try to talk with foreigners living in your home country's culture and hear what they think about your own culture. You will be suprised how your culture/country can create so much problems/integration issues for a foreigner.

Regards,

Lacrima

First of all thanks to all the posters for their sincere responses and I will be interested listening to more people about their opinion to these simple questions.

@Indian
I am not at all interested in your comment. Even though things were discussed earlier it doesn't mean you cannot rollback. If you are not interested please walk away from this post.

thanks for understanding!

Dear Babloo,

Where did i mention that this topic is not interesting to me? This is a very interesting topic to me.

I have added one more question! Thatz all.

So, I hope now i have your permission to stay here.

Hi Indian,

you are very welcome to stay here and to discuss everything.

@babloo

you are welcome, too. I think we can discuss this as often as necessary and we should discuss it. It is necessary to talk about such things, if somebody like you got bad experiences. Maybe it helps to speak it out. I myself completely agree with 'Nobody', but nevertheless I (as a German) take your comments seriously.

Why don't you join our meeting on the 7th of May? I would like to talk to you and of course, have some beer ;-)

By
Detlef

Hi
Yep, Detlef is right.Such discussions are OK, and can be repeated, provided no particular person is personally targeted.Being an old member of this forum, I have seen such discussions over and over again, but still find it interesting and worth discussing.

Hi Babloo
Well thats the truth, holding a passport proves nothing.
But intergration is still possible.Depends where you normally go to.There are locations in every city , where you'll find like minded people, and initiate good social contacts, but again if you play within rules and avoid trouble.The trick is like others explained before 'Li'l bit self marketing' you gotta to reach out for people.Once they know that you can be helpful to them, or you speak at their wavelength, then its not a big problem integrating, whether its the 'Multi-Kulti' Köln or the tight minded Berchtesgaden ;)

Others have already presented their opinions relating to your other questions.

All the best
GnR

Hi all,

Let me make it clear I did have some personal problems here in Germany and I am here since 1998 and I am also a Green Card holder and the reason I opened this topic is to find out how many of you think about these questions before you go for permanent residence. I think this is the right time to bring back this topic and to find out how your attitude changed in the course of your stay in Germany. Believe me these answers from different people should help each one of you unless you stick to your own principals and not care much for other views.

I am not going to debate here on any issues that relate to a person so I am completely out of arguments.

@Detlef
I know you are the owner of this wonderful forum and I appreciate your invitation but unfortunately I will not have much time for such gatherings. schade!

babloo

I always thaught I am the only one having such questions in mind. I dont know as my 5yr are coming to end , more and more I m looking for flying out. I dont blame anyone for this. I really tried to learn German language but after working 9am-6pm and then go for learning language , it didnt work. But if I know german language will it change something ?
Foriegner Office is too unfriendly. They look at you like .. I dont want to say.
I met ppl who are living with families , often complain about their childerns problem with integration with natives.
I think some english speaking country can be a good solution for me , because I still dont find myself going back home .
Sorry , my spell check was not working.

bye
Tali

@lacrima

The foreigners in our own countries can also have similar problems, but that doesn't mean that they are not complaining about their problems in their own forums. Probably they discuss the problems NxN times and they say that the culture and business there sucks!

I don't agree that anybody, who has complaints about the german people and the life in germany, is in culture-shock.

I think, some GC-holders follow this strategy:
If you have a crazy problem in germany and you are very angry, then you are probably in culture-shock. Try to think that the people here can not be so bad; bad people are everywhere on the world, not only here. It is only the culture-shock that makes you angry, so calm down and forget about the problems!!!!

Once was a very good post in this group. I follow also that strategy: Don't think much about the issues here. As GC-holders we are not here to correct those problems. That way you can have fewer gray hair.

But if you plan to stay here many many years, then I can only wish good luck for you.

KaaN

@KaaN
Sevgili Kaan
yesilkart.de de olan diyalogumuz sirasinda sanirim bunu aciklamistim sana..