Dear All,
What about the new law, if some one gets anual salary >63000 Euro can get NE?
How is it calculated, does it including urlaub and weinacht geld.

Thanks and regards-
ASM

"What about the new law, if some one gets anual salary >63000 Euro can get NE?"

There is no such law. It has been discussed some time ago among the German politicians, but it has not been a law, not even a law proposal. You will probably finish your 5 years and get NE anyway, before German politicians can decide on such a law.. ;)

Regards,

Lacrima

2. Permanent residence permit for highly qualified persons - §19 AufenthG

Scientists, university lecturers, specialists and leading managers with long professional experience, for example, will have the chance of getting the permanent residence permit immediately, if they do not need official support for integration.

The permanent residence permit is unlimited and includes the permission to work.

An example for someone who is highly qualified can be, that he/she earns the double of the amount which someone needs if he wants to get private insurance instead of the mandatory one.

This is around 95.000,- €

Good luck
Detlef

Well, I thought he was asking regarding this issue:
http://www.dw-world.de/dw/article/0,,2214851,00.html?maca=en-rss-en-bus-1025-rdf
as he was mentioning a new law.

This 85 - 95K thing for NE has been around for some time.(I guess, it is in force since 1.1.2005)
But there was a political discussion recently to lower the salary limit to 63K to get an NE immediately.(See the link above) That political discussion led to nothing. That was my point in my previous post.

Regards,

Lacrima

Hi Detlef, a small correction: it is 85.500 € for 2007.

Proof.

The law for NE to the high skilled people is defined in AufenthG §19:
http://www.aufenthaltstitel.de/aufenthaltsg.html#19

The minimum amount of annual gross income stated in this law is bound to Beitragsbemessungsgrenze (income limit) for health insurance:
http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beitragsbemessungsgrenze

The law states that a scientist or high skilled person who is getting so much gross annual income that is double of this money can get NE from §19.

According to the table at Wikipedia, in 2007 the limit of annual gross income for health insurance is 42.750 €. To get NE wrt. AufenthG §19, you must earn an annual gross income of 85.500 €. In other words, your monthly gross salary must be min. 7.125 €.

Klenze17.

I just wonder...is there someone who get 7000 / 8000 € bruto per month?
I mean from the ex GC's, and if there is, what kind of job it is?

Hi again,

read this:

Achtung Verwechslungsgefahr!

Nicht verwechseln darf man die Versicherungspflichtgrenze und die Beitragsbemessungsgrenze. Seit 2003 sind sie von einander losgelöst zu betrachten.

Versicherungs-Pflichtgrenze Beitrags-Bemessungsgrenze
Mit der Versicherungspflichtgrenze gibt der Gesetzgeber vor, bis zu welcher Einkommens-Höhe brutto (derzeit 3.975,00 Euro monatlich / 47.700 Euro pro Jahr) ein Arbeitnehmer automatisch Mitglied in der gesetzlichen Krankenversicherung (GKV) sein und bleiben muss.

Die Beitragsbemessungsgrenze legt fest, bis zu welchem Betrag vom Einkommen (derzeit 3.562,50 Euro monatlich / 42.750 Euro pro Jahr) Beiträge zur gesetzlichen Kranken- und Pflegeversicherung berechnet und abgeführt werden.

Die Beitragsbemessungsgrenze wurde zum 1. Januar 2006 von 42.300 auf 42.750 Euro angehoben und die Versicherungspflichtgrenze erhöhte sich von bislang 46.800 Euro auf 47.250 Euro.

Update 29.11.2006: Mittlerweile sind die voraussichtlichen Zahlen für die Versicherungspflichtgrenze 2007 bekannt gegeben geworden: 3.975,00 Euro im Monat bzw. 47.700 Euro im Jahr!

But at least... all depends ;-)

Have a nice weekend and good night
Detlef

"is there someone who get 7000 / 8000 € bruto per month?
I mean from the ex GC's, and if there is, what kind of job it is?"

@max

Usually experienced (SAP) Consultants and experienced Project Managers can earn that amount. If we think that, there are more that 10.000 (ex)-GClers, it is no surprise that some percentage of that people fall into this category.

Regards,

Lacrima

Hi,

I must point out again, that the paragraph 3 of the law [1] crystal clearly states that required minimum gross income is strictly bound to the double of the income limit of gesetzliche Krankenversicherung (state health insurance), which gives us 85.500 € for 2007 [2]:

3. Spezialisten und leitende Angestellte mit besonderer Berufserfahrung, die ein Gehalt in Höhe von mindestens dem Doppelten der Beitragsbemessungsgrenze der gesetzlichen Krankenversicherung erhalten.

max asks:
is there someone who get 7000 / 8000 € bruto per month?

The annual gross income of 85.500 € does not mean that the monthly salary must be 85.500 € / 12 = 7.125 €. If the Weihnachtsgeld (Xmas bonus), Urlaubsgeld (vacation bonus) and AT-Zulage (extra bonus) are included in gross income, then min. required monthly salary reduces down below 7.000 € (probably to 6.000 € level). On the contrary, due to recession in Germany companies tend to reduce bonuses overall, which leads requirement of salaries of higher than 7000 € for NE wrt. AufenthG §19 [1].

max, I am in the same opinion. I strongly belivee there are very very few foreigns who got their salaries in this level.

Lacrima answers:
Usually experienced (SAP) Consultants and experienced Project Managers can earn that amount.

There are very few foreigns in Germany who has NE wrt. AufenthG §19. In 2005 only 500-700 people got this type of NE [3]. This law thus does not have a wide audience.

Lacrima says:
If we think that, there are more that 10.000 (ex)-GClers, it is no surprise that some percentage of that people fall into this category.

No, the actual number of unique GCs is far below than 10.000, it is around 8000. Some people got new GC permissions after having lost 1st job, which are counted in the numbers [4].

For GClers: The most extensive academic research about us is [5].


Klenze17.

--
[1] AufenthG §19, http://www.aufenthaltstitel.de/aufenthaltsg.html#19
[2] Beitragsbemessungsgrenze, http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beitragsbemessungsgrenze
[3] Evaluierungsbericht zum Zuwanderungsgesetz, http://www.bmi.bund.de/Internet/Content/Common/Anlagen/Themen/Auslaender__Fluechtlinge__Asyl/DatenundFakten/Evaluierungsbericht__zum__Zuwanderungsgesetz,templateId=raw,property=publicationFile.pdf/Evaluierungsbericht_zum_Zuwanderungsgesetz.pdf
[4] Die Green Card für IT-Fachkräfte:
Bestandsaufnahme und Entwicklungsperspektive
arbeitsmarktbedingter Zuwanderung in Deutschland, http://www.ub.uni-konstanz.de/kops/volltexte/2003/933/pdf/steinfatt.pdf, page 63.
[5] Greencard für Ausländische IT-Fachkräfte, http://www.kompetenznetze.de/Redaktion/Zentralredaktion/Literatur/medien/de/info__Greencard,property=pdf.pdf . This is the last academic research about Greencard. I am afraid there won't be any other. But there is a Turkish scientist now who is making her PhD dissertation on GCs (but for Turkish people, Lacrima knows her too, we both participated in this academic research).

Hi shahisandeep,

1. if somebody earns more than 85,500 euros annually he/she can apply for a NE straightway.

Yes and it must be done ASAP, because next year it might be another value, as stated in the law.

2.Is bonus also considered to be a part of gehalt.

Yes, any single cent stated in the pay slip is considered. Bonus (AT-Zulage), Vermögenswirksame Leistung, even the company bonus paid for Arbeitsweg (the way between home and work). Requirement is all the money which is in the pay slip and taxed. Principally every single cent stated in the pay slips are taxed, so just calculate your pay slips. In some companies pay slips include cumulative sum of brutto income throughout the year, which eases the computation.

if anybody has already tried getting it , i would appreciate information.

Apart from rajeshspg, we don't know anyone here in these forums who got NE w.r.t. AufenthG $19.

This law item has been effective only for 700-900 people in Germany ( http://www.bmi.bund.de/Internet/Content/Common/Anlagen/Themen/Auslaender__Fluechtlinge__Asyl/DatenundFakten/Evaluierungsbericht__zum__Zuwanderungsgesetz,templateId=raw,property=publicationFile.pdf/Evaluierungsbericht_zum_Zuwanderungsgesetz.pdf ). Unfortunately none of them is a member of these forums.

Rajesh's case is special because he is not working in private companies, instead in academic institutions.

If you can get it, please share your experiences in these forums so that everyone can have an idea what is possible, what is not.

Klenze17.

Hi,

I have requested for NE under this category, and beamter asked me to come back after 4 weeks. He wanted to check with his superior regarding this.

Best of luck with your application. Since it is written in the law you should get it.

Regards,
Rakhi

hi Rakhi,

I have requested for NE under this category, and beamter asked me to come back after 4 weeks. He wanted to check with his superior regarding this.

Best of luck with your application. Since it is written in the law you should get it.

There are a lot of requirements stated in the NE w.r.t AufenthG §19 ( http://www.aufenthaltstitel.de/aufenthaltsg.html#19 ).

Rakhi, your application is very important for all foreigners in this forum, and it will be a leading case for this NE (except for Rajesh's case). Because that, may I ask you to write here with which qualifications you apply for this NE?

Patents? Publications? Management position?
Are you working in private company or state institution?

Klenze17.

Hi Klenze,

I have applied under income basis with special professional experience. I am working as IT freelancer. If I have to be a manager to be considered under this category, I may not get it. It would be great if someone can translate that complete paragraph of §19 into english.

Regards,
Rakhi

Hi,

you may find this website interesting:

http://www.zuwanderung.de/english/

http://www.zuwanderung.de/english/2_neues-gesetz-a-z/hochqualifizierte.html

I wish all of you a nice weekend!

Viele Grüße aus Berlin
Detlef :-)

Hi,
I am working as a self dependent and have a import/export business and annual income 90,000 to 120,000 Euro.
can I apply for NE?without integration course!!
my status is I am Indian and married with German.

Please give your suggestion.

Kumar

Detlef,

Thanks a lot for the information/links. The last statement of highly skilled worker definition says that "Highly qualified workers are typically executives or specialists in their field with a current annual salary in excess of €84,000".

So, if anyone who is specialist in their field and earns in excess of €84,000 should be eligible for NE. He need not be a scientist or manager. Anyway, I will wait for the first response from beamter regarding my case.

Regards,
Rakhi

Hi Rakhi,

So, if anyone who is specialist in their field and earns in excess of €84,000 should be eligible for NE. He need not be a scientist or manager.

This is true, but one small correction:

The annual brutto income stated in that text Detlef sent is outdated. In 2007 this has been 85.500 Euro. Please read my previous postings in this thread, in which I have given technical details how this amount is calculated.

This money is dependent upon tax calculations by German government and is adjusted on a year basis. That means, next year it can be 86.000 Euro. Since the inflation in developed countries like Germany is small, we do not expect big jumps in this amount.

Wow, a lot of freelancers here! Do you guys (Rakhi, shahisandeep) have IT background? Did you work in Germany for a while first? I don't expect too personal information a small historical background of yourself would be helpful for everyone here in the forums to get this kind of NE!

Klenze17.

Klenze,

Yes, I saw your earlier post regarding the required income for this year.

Well, I came here on GC in 2003. I got a freelance contract last year and changed my visa to restricted freelance visa(This was taken care by my agency). Recently I came to know about this NE as per §19 from this forum.Thanks a lot to the people sharing valuable information on this platform. I hope the beamter gives a positive response.

Regards,
Rakhi

Guys,

Bad news is that freelancers are not eligible under $19. So, I will not be getting NE. Anyway thanks a lot for all the help by providing useful information.

Regards,
Rakhi

Hi,
I am working as a selfdependent and have a import/export business and annual income 90,000 to 120,000 Euro.
can I get NE?without integration course!!
my status is I am Indian and married with German.

Please give your suggestion.

Kumar

The last changes in several laws are here:
http://www.lexisnexis.de/aktuelles/122701?or=14&ur=0&tt=gesetzgebung
(see the PDF link)

I got the visa under §19 on the salary basis. i am a telecom engineer.

Hello Shahisandeep,

Are you salaried employ or freelancer?

Regards,
Rakhi

Hello @havehope

i have 2 questions for you.

1. is your salary is >63000 including bonus and all?

2. will they ask about experience (how many years do you have exp in Germany).

thank you

Salary has to be more than (today its around 87000 Euros ).
you need to show last 3 months salary or a proof or a confirmantion from your compnay that you shall be getting this salayr by end of this year. or proof of last year brutto is also ok. In my case i could show them my last year brutto on the lohnstuer card and also my company gave me the bescheinung.

They need 4-6 weeks for the police check up and you get the NE. No questions asked about langiage or so,

havehope wrote:

Salary has to be more than (today its around 87000 Euros ).
you need to show last 3 months salary or a proof or a confirmantion from your compnay that you shall be getting this salayr by end of this year. or proof of last year brutto is also ok. In my case i could show them my last year brutto on the lohnstuer card and also my company gave me the bescheinung.

They need 4-6 weeks for the police check up and you get the NE. No questions asked about langiage or so,

Hi Havehope, you wrote that you got NE $19.

- Did you come to Germany with Greencard?
- Did you get "Erwerbstätigkeit gestattet" in between, before you got this NE?

I think you are a GCler because you said you are a telecom engineer.

Yesterday the parliamented changed the law. Now the minimum salary reduced to 63.000 Euro (correctly, 63.600 Euro for 2008, 64,800 for 2009).
http://www.bundestag.de/parlament/plenargeschehen/to/187.html#TOP27

This is the best law it could come ever. There is a big world crisis. The foreigners in Germany had the chance that the German elections are in 2009. Otherwise such kind of law would have never come.

Thanks klenze17.
Indeed good news if it works.

Has this rule(NE for 63000€) been already implemented ?

I need to renew my Aufenthaltstitel. So can I try NE as my Brutt is around 64000€ ?

Do you know what are the documents that may be required to get this ?

Your reply is very much helpful for many boarders.

Thanks,
Truster

Has this rule(NE for 63000€) been already implemented ?

Not yet. All the technical things of the law change has been done. Also, Bundestag (parliament) approved the law on 13.11.2008.

Now Bundesrat must approve it, councellor Angela Merkel and minister president Horst Köhler must sign the change. The law change will be published in Bundesgesetzblatt (official announcement paper from state) that the law becomes effetive.

Only after all these, the law will be effective in 01.01.2009.

I need to renew my Aufenthaltstitel. So can I try NE as my Brutt is around 64000€ ?

Yes, but only after the law becomes effective. It is after 01.01.2009. Before that, you cannot do anything.

Do you know what are the documents that may be required to get this ?

By the definition of this law, the local authorities will ask you to prove that you have this salary. I think the last 3 slips of previous year must be OK, but in general I think a prinout for your complete year from Finanzamt might be asked. They must see that you get this money.

Also, the law does not give everyone who has this salary or more. Your job specification must match "high-qualification". It is not stated in law explicitly, but it is mostly IT sector, electronics, computer and mechanical engineering.

Ex-Greencardlers would match. But we have no leading case for this, because we must wait until 01.01.2009 when first applications run.

havehope, a member in this forum was a telecom engineer and he has got his NE w.r.t. $19 but with 84.000 euro salary requirement. He is the only case we know. rajeshspg is an academician who has got NE $19 but as a scientist.

Technically all the GCs who still do not have NE must be able to get this NE, as long as they satisfy this salary requirement.

To whom who is interested: There is Verordnung for this law change: http://www.bundesrat.de/cln_090/nn_8694/SharedDocs/Drucksachen/2008/0801-900/840-08,templateId=raw,property=publicationFile.pdf/840-08.pdf .

So everything is ready for this law change. Just wait until January.

In the coming day we will hear more about this in press. Just wait.

Klenze17.

Yesterday the Bundesrat has approved the law change.
http://www.bundesrat.de/cln_099/SharedDocs/Drucksachen/2008/0801-900/861-08,templateId=raw,property=publicationFile.pdf/861-08.pdf

Only the signatures of Councellor Angela Merkel and minister president Horst Köhler required for the law change. Bundesgesetzblatt will publish the law.

I can say that now 84K requirement to get NE for Hochqualifizierte has been history. With this law change the minimum annual gross salary must be 63.600 Euro (2008), 64.800 Euro (2009) to get the NE.

Klenze17.

Unfortunately the Bundesrat refused the current law change, because they find the minimum salary 63600 still too much. They want to reduce it to 53.400 Euro. Therefore they asked the additional commission to review the law change.

Damned, the 1 month left until the law becomes effective and this unclear situation makes the situation of a lot of foreign workers in Germany very bad and keep us with no perspective!! The world crisis is hitting everywhere in the world and German companies started to lay off people everywhere. Playing with the law changes just before 01.01.2009 in this situation makes the situation of the law very unclear. It can be completely void because these kind of decisions for foreigns can go even ineffective. In this crisis a lot of companies fire people and they might object to these kind of laws. The only chance we have is the Elections in 2009.

Damned!! Very bad, to be honest... Bundesrat doesn't see the current economic and market situation...

Klenze17.

http://www.bundesrat.de/cln_090/SharedDocs/TO/851/erl/4,templateId=raw,property=publicationFile.pdf/4.pdf

and

http://www.pressrelations.de/new/standard/result_main.cfm?pfach=1&n_firmanr_=110858&sektor=pm&detail=1&r=348478&sid=&aktion=jour_pm&quelle=0

Announcement from Bundesrat:
http://www.bundestag.de/dasparlament/2008/49/innenpolitik/22908287.html

Bundesrat insists on reducing the recently change minimum gross annual salary of 63.600 Euro down to 53.400 Euro. The government declared before this salary too low to give unlimited residence permit.

Bundesrat and the government are still discussing on this. It is just 1 month left to 1st of January, when the law should be effective. Last Sunday there was a comment in Frankfurter Allgemeine that the law in these conditions would not be effective in 1st of January because still continuing discussions.

I am afraid it will go to another vote in the Bundestag. No matter what happens, I wish that the salary of 86.400 Euro in the law would be decreased to a reasonable level.

There are several statistical publications from the state that there were very, very few foreigners who took NE wrt AuthenhG $19.

In this crisis I think 53.400 is reasonable. But after the downturn this limit must be increased again.

30 days left to 1st of January and we are still waiting for a stable status!

Klenze17.

Hi everybody:

Just a question about this subject...it seems to me that even if the law changes and reduces the minimum yearly salary, those who are already in DE won't be able to apply for NE because the §19 states that this apply to foreigners arriving to DE...
I will be given a rise in salary that will push me above the limit of >63000 but I don't think I'll be able to apply since I've been here already for several years...can someone comment on this?

may the peace be in your soul

Ary

This is not true.

There are people, like rajeshspg and havehope, who got NE $19, after they have come to DE. If they had given that only to the people who are arriving in DE, that would have been too ineffective, because there are very few people who have come to Germany in the recent years.

This law is effective for everyone who can prove in written form (contract or finance authorities) that he or she can earn 63.600 Euro (or 53.400 Euro if they change it).

Klenze17.

I want to make one point clearer:

Not all the people whose salary is higher 63.600 will have right to get this permit.

Only the people under the description "hochqualifizierte auslaendische Fachkraefte". Ex-Greencard'ler match this description. All computer, electrical, mechanical engineers and IT-specialists.

Not everyone.

Klenze17.

Vermittlungsausschuss (advisory committee) will hold a meeting on 17th of December to discuss the Bundesrat's objection on the minimum gross annual income for NE $19:
http://www.bundesrat.de/cln_099/nn_6898/DE/presse/pm/2008/189-2008.html?__nnn=true

Bundesrat wants to reduce the salary to 53K. Government wanted 63K.

The committee members are 50% from Bundesrat and 50% from Bundestag (parliament). If the committee decision is the same as Bundesrat, the government must reformulate the law and it must be voted in Bundestag again.

On the one hand, reducing the salary is good but on the other hand the process will take so long that it will not be effective on 01.01.2009, stated by the law. This will be then very close to the Elections in June 2009, and might be void...

A lot of qualified people in Germany are waiting for a stable status of this law. The crisis is hitting everywhere in Europe, people are getting jobless. All state bodies (Bundesrat, Bundestag, government and this committee) must be very fast. If this law will not be effective as soon as possible, in 2009 a lot of us will be jobless!

Klenze17.

Today the Vermittlungsausschuss (commission in the parliament) has got a meeting and still not decided what to do with the minimal salary to give the unlimited work/residence permit to the qualified foreigners. They did not decide yet whether 63K or 53K must be the minimum annual gross income to give the high-qualified foreigners unlimited work/residence permit.

However the Vermittlungsauschuss has decided to reduce the minimum amount of money to be invested by the freelancer to found a company, to give an unlimited residence permit. They reduced this amount from 500.000 Euro to 250.000 Euro.

Vermittlungsausschuss will held another meeting on 19.12.2008 to discuss the minimum salary for unlimited residence permit.

In this global crisis I am sure nobody has interest on 250.000 Euro/500.000 Euro stuff. Instead, if you concentrate on unlimited permit of the people, they even can be then freelancer with no money restriction.

Germany is very slow... Foreign investments are overseen.. Every second, minute is a loss for Germany.

2009 will be a very bad year. It still surprises me that still nobody has commented on this. A lot of forum members will be jobless in 2009.

Klenze17.

"2009 will be a very bad year. It still surprises me that still nobody has commented on this. A lot of forum members will be jobless in 2009.
"
Hi Klenze17 - Happy new year 2009 to you too! ;)

@klenze

I dont understand why you are so fixed up on this particular part of the legislation. Forget about it, concentrate on your survival. When are you eligible for normal NE? I think you should already have BE.

raj asks:

I dont understand why you are so fixed up on this particular part of the legislation. Forget about it, concentrate on your survival. When are you eligible for normal NE? I think you should already have BE.

Raj, I don't know whether you have NE or not, but this law change is a very good improvement for the foreign people, because it will give the NE immediatetly. This is the best law since Greencard. Therefore it is especially important for all of us.

I am a GCler who came to Germany end of December 2004 and I still have no NE, because only 4 years passed. The crisis is growing exponentially in Europe and I need this law because I will get NE with this law without 5 year requirement. There are a lot of people in this situation.

The law will be effective on 1st of January, 10 days left and still not clarified. I need this law so that I can inform my HR, because in Germany all companies will fire the foreign people who do not have unlimited permit in this crisis. My company is firing a lot of people now.

There were several similar discussions about GC w.r.t. ZuwG at Trust7. I think you are GCler, therefore I think you don't see this point. You can never understand what I am experiencing here. I am trying here to share a tough stuff which is not easy to find in the press. So, please be patient and think twice when you send a post.

Klenze17.

<i>The law will be effective on 1st of January, 10 days left and still not clarified. I need this law so that I can inform my HR, because in Germany all companies will fire the foreign people who do not have unlimited permit in this crisis. My company is firing a lot of people now.</i>

Hi,
I don't think that is a fair statement you put there.
As long as you have unlimited contract you can get your visa extension..
and to fire people they mostly look at how long an employee is with the company apart from other performance reasons.

If you think you can be fired(hope not) based on not having an unlimited visa, thats kind of ridiculous.

After all the we can only wait for the law
cheers

I wrote:

The law will be effective on 1st of January, 10 days left and still not clarified. I need this law so that I can inform my HR, because in Germany all companies will fire the foreign people who do not have unlimited permit in this crisis. My company is firing a lot of people now.

rajendrak wrote:

I don't think that is a fair statement you put there.
As long as you have unlimited contract you can get your visa extension.. and to fire people they mostly look at how long an employee is with the company apart from other performance reasons.

What is not fair? It does not matter whether you have an unlimited contract or not. If there is world crisis and if people must be fired, if the company wants to fire people, or if there is Sozialplan, then nobody cares what you have. You will be just fired.

If you think you can be fired(hope not) based on not having an unlimited visa, thats kind of ridiculous.

You might find ridiculuous but I see around in the big companies the foreigners are fired first, no matter if they have unlimited contract or not, no matter if they have unlimited residence permit or not.

Now in this case, if you don't have unlimited residence permit, you must go to Arbeitsamt, which is really annoying. And you are not eligible to stay in Germany forever. In this crisis it is extremely difficult to find a job because next year a lot of people will jobless.

After all the we can only wait for the law cheers.

Yes, it has been neverending story.. Only 10 days left before the law must be effective and still the things are not clear.

Klenze17.

Law PASSED! Bundesrat approved the law finally:

http://www.bundestag.de/aktuell/archiv/2008/23098237_kw51_rueckblick/index.html

Der Bundestag stimmte den Einigungsvorschlägen des Vermittlungsausschusses zum Arbeitsmigrationssteuerungsgesetz (16/11390), zum BKA-Gesetz (16/11391) und zum Familienleistungsgesetz mit der damit verbundenen Erhöhung des Kindergeldes (16/11392) zu. Am 19. Dezember gab auch der Bundesrat\ seine Zustimmung, die er diesen Gesetzen zunächst verweigert hatte.

16/11390 is the decision of the commission for the law which regulates the minimum salary for NE $19.

84K for NE $19 has been now officially history!

Klenze17.

Great News indeed!!! It couldn't have come on a better time for me, having spent almost 2 hrs this morning to rescue my laptop from the evil clutches of Antivirus 360 (a real pain in ass).

Thanks a lot Klenze17 for keeping us updated with this good info.

Cheers.

Great News indeed!!! It couldn't have come on a better time for me, having spent almost 2 hrs this morning to rescue my laptop from the evil clutches of Antivirus 360 (a real pain in ass).

Yes, it is really great news!! I hope we get NE immediatiely, without waiting for regular NE time. In this crisis nobody guarantees work. NE is the only survival now in Germany. And this law will give NE immediately.

Since the change is a very special part of the law, I am pretty sure that it will be very problematic with officials at local authorities (Ausländerbehörde Beamten). They will resist mostly, I am pretty sure. Because in this crisis a lot of foreigners will be jobless and therefore they might not correctly process our cases, among so many jobless foreigners in 2009.

Therefore I strongly advise to talk with a lawyer. I will soon print all the law changes to use a print-copy to both the Ausländebehörde and the lawyer.

Thanks a lot Klenze17 for keeping us updated with this good info.

This stuff is extremely difficult to find in the press because almost no press comment on this law. The reason seems to be that even there are very few foreigners in Germany who get this 63K. Very few news published in the press recently.

Therefore I had to follow decisions, commissions at the parliament, every day.

There is no leading case for this law change! I would propose to wait until first week of January.

I ask all Trust7 members who might get NE wrt 63.600 Euro to share their experiences. We need a leading case for this, what to do next.

We might need professional support this. Detlef, is there any activity on your side for this?


Very good New Year gift!!!!!

Klenze17

Great news just before holiday season.

@Klenze17,

Does this change effects for the annual salary >63k or >53k?

Thanks,

Suresh

Suresh asks:

Does this change effects for the annual salary >63k or >53k?

It will be 63K after 01.01.2009. Bundesrat's proposal to reduce 53K was not approved. Only people having an annual salary of higher than 63K will be granted to this NE.

And only "high-qualified people". Not everyone. For example, freelancers cannot get it. I heard people in finance sectors cannot get it. Only people having electronics/computer/mechanical maybe chemical engineering and Ex-Greencard'lers will get this NE.

But we need a leading case for this.

For whom it may concern:

This law item will be changed:
http://www.aufenthaltstitel.de/aufenthaltsg.html#19

law change is here:
http://www.bmi.bund.de/Internet/Content/Common/Anlagen/Gesetze/Entwurf__Arbeitsmigrationsgesetz,templateId=raw,property=publicationFile.pdf/Entwurf_Arbeitsmigrationsgesetz.pdf

Changed sentence:
In § 19 Abs. 2 Nr. 3 werden die Wörter „dem Doppelten der Beitragsbemessungsgrenze
der gesetzlichen Krankenversicherung“ durch die Wörter „der Beitragsbemessungsgrenze
der allgemeinen Rentenversicherung“ ersetzt.

This is 63.600 Euro for 2008, 64.800 for 2009. Therefore we must apply for this as soon as possible.

Klenze17.

Hi,

first of all I want to thank you, Klenze17, for providing us this very important information!!!!

I read my newspaper every day, especially the political and economy parts, but I did not read one word about this!

I also agree with you about your view of the upcoming problems.

Regarding the new possibilities I will talk to Katja from VPMK about a special offer for trust7 members, to get NE easy :-)

Thanks again
Detlef

This is 63.600 Euro for 2008, 64.800 for 2009. Therefore we must apply for this as soon as possible.

Are you trying to say that one can use the limit 63.600 instead of 64.800 when he manages to apply before 1.1.2009 ?

If it is 64.800 for 2009 then that will be the valid number for the law which will become effective after 1.1.2009. I don't think that you can apply now by referencing a law which didn't become effective yet. So the number 63.600 shouldn't be considered in the context of this law, as it is only for 2008.

Regards,

Lacrima