Hello,

So called term "Beschäftigung erlaubt", is it possible for someone to explain what does this mean, how to get it, pros&cons of it ?

Anybody got that until now ?

Thanks in advance!

this is almost similar to NE for work in Germany.

Hi MK,
BE is almost similar to NE, what do u mean by that? do u know any reference from law? or do people get more rights due to having it?

hi all,

What are the benefits of *FREE LANCER*...can someone shed some light on this topic?

If you work as free lancer (Selbständiger) you can theoretically charge more than 100 Euro / hour (SAP specialist for example). Some typical programming costs around 65 Euro / hour. So this is of course approx 3 x more than "normal" programmer salary. So you can definitely earn more. On the other hand you do not have right to Arbeitslosengeld, and you have to pay your pension yourself etc. Also the project duration is anything from 2 weeks to 2 years. Typical is 3 months, 6 months it depends. After the project is finished it also can happen (and I have seen it happen) that freelancer does not get payed because somebody is not happy with his work, or the company simply does not want to pay. So you can go to court :-) and fight. You also have more responsibility for what you are doing. There are lot of details which I also do not know precisely. But you have got the idea: More money with more stress and less security.

Check gulp.de, this is freelancer project database.

thanks..

how about taxation?

do I still need to pay this renten? or arbeitloss versichurng?

"Beschäftigung erlaubt" and "Freelancer",
are they the same thing ? I do not think they are.

no, they are not...but i dont know how to open a new topic

how to open a new topic:

click Forums, and then the type of topic you want (like Visa Questions, Deutsch lernen!, Intregration etc.) You will see a "New" button on the start of the page.

When I got BE on my Passport the officer told me that I am not allowed to work Selbstständig !!! I am only allowed to work as a Angestellte !!!

So I do not think BE is similar to NE !!!

Regards

According to BeschVerfV §13, "Beschäftigung Erlaubt" should be free from any restriction on "employer, time, place, profession".

So I think with that clause you can even work as selbstandig. Please correct me with references if I am not right.

Hi mk,

If you get any reference that BE is similar to NE pls let me know because my information is based on what the beamter told me when I got BE on my passport and from experience we know that Beamter really do not know much laws !!!

Regards !!

BE is similar to NE only for work - I guess. BE permits you to do any kind of jobs as does NE.

BE!=NE. BE - "arbeitsgenehmigung". NE - "Aufenthaltsgenehmigung"
Gem. § 2.2. AufenthG "Erwerbstätigkeit ist die selbständige Tätigkeit und die Beschäftigung"

Mit NE darf man auch selbständig arbeiten, mit "BE" nur als Angestellte.

http://www.aufenthaltstitel.de/aufenthaltsg.html#2

"BE" hilft eine NE zu kriegen wenn alle andere Voraussetzungen gegeben sind (ohne AMC). § 46.2 reicht auch aus um eine NE nach 5 Jahren zu erhalten, da solche Zustimmung auch eine unbefristete Erlaubnis zu Ausübung der Beschäftigung ist.

Mit "BE" darf man jede unselbständige Tätigkeit ausüben, mit §46.2 nur IT-Tätigkeit.

Nemo you are oft right but now you are almost completely wrong.
BE != NE
that is true but for work
BE = NE on work area
with both you can skip AMC and be selbstständig.

Beschäftigung != Erwerbstätigkeit.

I think Nemo has right since it is defined by low what means "Beschäftigung".

Therefore, simply:
"Beschäftigung gestattet" != "Erwerbstätigkeit gestattet".

To Otto-Normale-Menschen seems it is the same, but as defined in low it gives a chance to any Beamter to complain when you start working as selbstständig.

But when I got my BE, the Beamter told me that I could
- work in any area that I wanted
- open my own company if I wanted
- switch jobs as often as I wanted
- work as freelancer if I wanted

So we bac to the o' same situation that I can only good summarize by a saying of my country "1000 watches show 1000 different hours".

D.

@nobody

I am getting very nervous about all this drama with ABH and AA, since i have a penting request at ABH for a job change . I decided to meet Fr. Gebhard in munich Arbeitsamt (whom I met several times regarding my GC), so could you plz correct me if I am wrong?

1) A BE is an another name for the arbeitserlaubnis without the firma name on the stamp and limited to 3 years according to §13.2 BeschVerfV

2) I have the right to get BE beschäftigung erlaubt according to §9 BeschVerfV, as I am working in Germany since last 3.5 years as GC.

Thanks and reqards,
Alvin

2DvD
No, I’m right :-)

“with both you can … be selbstständig” – this is wrong.You cann’t be selbstg with "BE", sorry. But you cann apply by ABH for this permit for the selbst. (with Begruednung)

2BiliPiton
Exactly

2 aantony
>>>1) A BE is an another name for the arbeitserlaubnis without the firma name on the stamp and limited to 3 years according to §13.2 BeschVerfV

>>>>2) I have the right to get BE beschäftigung erlaubt according to §9 BeschVerfV, as I am working in Germany since last 3.5 years as GC.

(Arbeitserlaubnis = z. B. beschäftigung erlaubt als____; oder beschäftigung erlaubt by Fa_______; oder beschäftigung erlaubt bis______) BE gem. §§9 BeshcVerfV is an another name for the Arbeitsberechtigung. You have right to get it after 3 years working in Germany with Aufenthaltseraubnis.

If BE erlaubt keine Selbstständige Tätigkeit warum gibt es dann Auflage:
"Selbstständige Tätigkeit nicht gestattet"


i think even if Beschäftigung as a word does not mean Selbstständige Tätigkeit even than Selbstständige Tätigkeit is erlaubt because there is no "Selbstständige Tätigkeit nicht gestattet" Auflage in pass

Hi *,

there are two different possibilties.

1st 'Beschäftigung erlaubt' means, that one is allowed to do any kind of job, without restrictions to IT or any other branch.

2nd 'Erwerbstätigkeit erlaubt' means, that one may start his own business or may work in any branch.

So, of course, the 2nd possibility is much better, almost like NE, but a GC can not expect it, it is not in the law. But, on the other hand, it is possible to get and our vpmk lawyers got it already for some clients. But it is a matter of 'Ermessen' (discretion) of the officers at AB, so it is a matter of clever applying and good communication skills.

Therefore I always recommend to hire a lawyer with such important things.

Have a nice week
Detlef

AufenthG

§ 2 Begriffsbestimmungen

(2) Erwerbstätigkeit ist die selbständige Tätigkeit und die Beschäftigung im Sinne von § 7 des Vierten Buches Sozialgesetzbuch.

§ 7 SGB 4:

(1) Beschäftigung ist die nichtselbständige Arbeit, insbesondere in einem Arbeitsverhältnis. Anhaltspunkte für eine Beschäftigung sind eine Tätigkeit nach Weisungen und eine Eingliederung in die Arbeitsorganisation des Weisungsgebers.

therefore

§ 21 Selbständige Tätigkeit AufenthG

is to be applied. And according to definition of "Bechäftigung" the aditional definition is not necessary. If you work as Selbständig with "Beschäftigung erlaubt" you make yourself strafbar :-(. You need "Erwerbstätitgkeit gestattet/erlaubt".

and Detlef is (unfortunately) :-( right.

hum looks like I mislead people, just checked my passport and I came to see that what I do have is not a BE but the "Erwerbstätigkeit gestattet" clause, reason why I had all these sayings from the Beamter.

Sorry.

D.

At the end of the day,
with "Besch. Erlaubt" issued on our passports, are we able to change jobs without making a wonderful visit to Ausländerbehörde/IntagrationAmt/Arbeitsamt ?