Hallo Everybody,

First I thank the founder of this blog "Trust7" to open a wonderful helping community.
I got the NE from Blue card rule.
Let me explain the rule which is as follows:

1. A blue card holder is eligible for NE when he/she had contributed to the pension scheme for 33months with high qulification job and salary according to the Blaue Karte EU rule and the remaining sub-senctence from the §9 should be satisfied (especially 7 and 8). This law says that there should be sufficient German knowledge with Fundamental, social system and way of living in Germany should be known.As per law this requirement will be satisfied through Integration course (B1 + orientation course).

2. If the blue card holder can prove his German language skill to the level of B1, then the 60 months of pension scheme period is reduced to 21 months, but the remaining sub-sentence from the §9 should be satisfied. This law says that there should be sufficient German knowledge with Fundamental, social system and way of living in Germany should be known. (In this case the requirement is only the fundamental system in Germany, which could be satisfied through Orientation Course ).

The introduction of new rule for Niederlassungerlaubnis (§19.Absatz.6) under blue card scheme only reduces the Pension scheme period from 60 months to 33 months, 21 months in case of successful completion of B1-exam and not the language and orientation course exemption.

Please note that the blue card with 33 months is not the complete prequisite for Niederlassungerlaubnis.

The complete prequisite the officer can demand is:

1. Blue card + Blue card Job + 33 months of pension money + Integration course (According to §9 Absatz 7 and 8)

1. Blue card + Blue card Job + 21 months of pension money + B1-Certificate + Orientation course (According to §9 Absatz 8)

Its upto the officer how much weightage He/she give to the Integration course (According to §9 Absatz 7 and 8).

I say this because eventhough I completed B1 in 21 months and I hold a Bluecard Job, they just denied NE according to §9 Absatz 8,(über Grundkenntnisse der Rechts- und Gesellschaftsordnung und der Lebensverhältnisse im Bundesgebiet verfügt) which demands for Orientation course.

But I got the NE, as they assumed I know very well fundamental rights, Social system and way of living in Germany and also I have registered for the Orientation test.

But the §9 Absatz 7 and 8, its up to the officer to decide.

So here luck plays a factor.....

This was my experience.....
Have a nice weekend.......

Cheers
BT

Hi BT

1st of all congratulations on getting NE & sharing your experience to community.

1. Blue card + Blue card Job + 21 months of pension money + B1-Certificate + Orientation course (According to §9 Absatz 8)
From the above, could you please help me to understand more about Orientation course
- Where can i find more details of this?
- Is integration course and Orientation course both are same synonym?

I would also like to join and comlete this as soon as possible. fyi - i am from Frankfurt.

Many thanks
Tony

Hallo Tony,

Greetings,
To answer your question:
1. Where can i find more details of this?
Orientation course: This course is about the politics, history, and life style in Germany. (60 hours).
After the end of the course you need to take the exam its about 25 question (multiple choice), you need to get 12 out of 25 to pass this test, and in general there are about 250 questions, when you know all this question you dont need to attend the Orientation course. The question you can find under this link

    http://oet.bamf.de/pls/oetut/f?p=524:1:726408022730850:::::

Is integration course and Orientation course both are same synonym? -

No they are not the same.
Integration course = Deutsch B1-Zertifikat + Orientation course.

Hope this would have clarified your questions....

Cheers
BT

Hello,

Congrats  for getting the NE !
I would like to know whether one can get the NE if
1. One does not have a Blue card right now (usual BE instead)
2. one has 40 months of pension contribution
3. One has done integration course with B1 certificate

Can one get the NE straight away without going through the blue card route ?

Regards,

HI BT,

Thanks for sharing this info. Could you also throw some light on 2 more queries :

1) What if a blue card holder (like me) does not (or cannot) pass the so called integration course even after 4 years? Will the authorities issue a new Blue card once the current one has expired?

2) If a NE holder wishes to move back to his home country for professional or personal reasons, does the NE lose validity because the residence is no longer inside Germany? <A US Green Card holder, for example, can reside in India but is obliged to return to the US every 24 months or so to keep the GC valid>

Looking forward to your responses.

Hi 10dulkar,

Greetings,
Answer to your questions as following:

1. As I mentioned in my first publish, this Integration course is a "GREY-AREA" where luck plays, some authorities will accept and others will not, in my case only B1 is sufficient even-then they asked for the orientation course. But I know people get NE without any huddels even though they have not taken any integration course and have no B1 and Orientation certificate. This truly depends on the officer. But as per law the officer can demand these 2 certificate and its in his hand to decide if he/she can waive you only on this 2 points (B1 and Orientation)[Pls note the other points from the law you have to satisfy in those points he cannot influnce].

At no cause (either you pass nor you don't take the Integration course) your blue card extension should be denied by the officer, provided you have the contract from your old or new employer.

2. The NE will expire when you are out of Europe for 6 months, if you are out of Germany for more than 6 months and want to come back you need to talk to your region's Forigen Officer. Normally when your employer is based on Germany and you get German salary and contribute to German pension scheme, then it is not a problem (I know one of my colleague from our Region who dose it) you get easily waive from the officer, the other situation you must discuss with them directly.

Hope your questions are answered

Cheers
BT

Hello BT,

Congrats  for getting the NE !
I would like to know whether one can get the NE if
1. One does not have a Blue card right now (usual BE instead)
2. one has 40 months of pension contribution
3. One has done integration course with B1 certificate

Can one get the NE straight away without going through the blue card route ?

Hallo Trueplus,

Greetings,
Here are the reply for your query:
Can one get the NE straight away without going through the blue card route ?

The answer is yes and no. In my case the answer is "No" first Blue-Card then NE (€.110 + €.140), A member of this forum (who had paid approx. 40 months RV and had a job and Salary what blue card says) had got directly NE without blue card (Which means he saved €.110 approx. for the blue card).

It depends on officer who process your extension.
In your case you are fully qualified to NE via Blue-card, provided your 40 months represents a Job and salary equivalent to what Blue card law says.

Hope I answered your question.

Cheers
BT

HI BT,

Many thanks for your responses. They certainly answer my questions. Even in the case of giving the BC itself, my company's relocation agent told me that ABH denied BC to some people because they did not consider their degrees as equivalent to a German diplom/master's.

Where did you apply for NE? i.e. a big city? I've noticed that kind of also influences decisions. For example in Munich (because of many foreigner workers here) the processes seem to be much easier than in smaller town ABH.

Hello BT,

I am still a bit ahead, but have a few question, perhaps you could answer them:

1. I have a TestDaF certificate with a 4/4/4/4 grade certificate (which means - C1.1 according to here: http://www.testdaf.de/teilnehmer/tn-info_nivea.php), but not a regular school test certificate. Does it still apply?
2. Before converting my residence permit to BC I had a part-time work permit based on a study based residence permit, based on which I started my job, which qualifies for BC. I did not graduate in Germany. I paid 2+ months RV before being granted BC. Can I apply for NE once I have 21 pay slips, or must the 21 pay slips be dated after BC was initially provided?
3. Can one simply enlist to the orientation course without being referred to it by Ausländerbehörde? I would expect it to be an inherent part of the NE process itself and not a prerequirement for it...

Thanks in advance,
N.

Hallo Nadav74,

Greetings...
Here are my points for your questions:
1. I think the TestDaF certificate should be taken to consideration for your NE via Bluecard, but I don't have any Idea, Please make a printout from the webpage and present to your ABH. Also when C1.1 is written on the certificate then there is no doubt that you are over qualified, when it says only the grade (4/4/4/4) and not the Nievue then you need more paper or proof for the C1.1. level. (Pls consult your ABH).

2. Before granting you BC, if the salary was above or equal to the BC-Salary, then you can count the 2 months for your NE, if the salary is less than BC-Salary then you cannot.

3. You can enlist yourself to Orientation course test without being reffered by ABH. The test alone is very easy you will have 25 question from 250 questions of multiple choice, you can register only for the exam in Volkshochschule and the test will cost you approx. €.25.

Here is the link to prepare for your exam:
http://oet.bamf.de/pls/oetut/f?p=524:30:989545743751905::NO:::

Hope I answered your query.

Cheers
BT.

Hallo BT,

Thanks for your answers. They are very helpful

LG aus Berlin,
N.

Hello BT,

thank you for sharing your experience. It is very useful. I would like to ask where I can find the original law statements about blue card and NE application.

Thank you very much and look forward to your reply.

Yang

Holders of the EU Blue Card in Germany can apply for an unlimited national residence title (Niederlassungserlaubnis). In order to obtain this settlement permit, they must not only meet the general preconditions but also have been engaged in highly skilled employment for 33 months and have paid contributions into a retirement scheme for this period. The further conditions of Section 9, sub-section 2, no. 2 and nos. 4-6,8 und 9 of the German Residence Act also apply. In the case of no. 8, EU Blue Card holders who possess a university degree are assumed to have a minimal need for integration and do not therefore need to provide proof of a completed orientation course. If holders of the EU Blue Card provide proof of an adequate knowledge of the German language (level B1), they can apply for a settlement permit for Germany after only 21 months.

Thank you very much for the prompt reply.

"In the case of no. 8, EU Blue Card holders who possess a university degree are assumed to have a minimal need for integration and do not therefore need to provide proof of a completed orientation course. "
Must this "university degree" be obtained in Germany? or overseas university degree which can be approved by ZAB(Zentralstelle für ausländisches Bildungswesen)?

The"German Residence Act", is there anywhere I can find? Just in case if the visa officer asks about it, I can find some original statements to quote.

Very much appreciate it, thank you.

with NE you can be stay outside Germany for 6 months, with special request 1 year.  Get into some complex arrangement - ask them to pay salary in your GErman bank account, maintain a house in Germany .. do not deregister.  OR refuse to go to US OR resign

Nice sharing, Congrats for your NE !

I am a freelance with Blue card permit, and i'm not entitled to pension scheme. do i still have chance to get NE after 21 months with B1 ?

thanks

I read that Blue card is only awarded for 4 years. What if a blue card holder does not have the German integration course (German B1 + integration Course )even after 4 years? Will the authorities issue a new Blue card once the current one has expired?

I understand that one will transferred from Blue Card -> Niederlassungserlaubnis after 33 months stay, but are there any exceptions to this clause.

Thanks,Sanjay

Hi Saini
Did you get Niederlassungserlaubnis after 33 months stay (Blue Card Route) with German B1 Certificate.

Thanks,

Sanjay

Hi All

Someone please answer my query, if they know about it:
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I read that Blue card is only awarded for 4 years. What if a blue card holder does not have the German integration course (German B1 + integration Course )even after 4 years? Will the authorities issue a new Blue card once the current one has expired?
I understand that one will transferred from Blue Card -> Niederlassungserlaubnis after 33 months stay, but are there any exceptions to this clause. 

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