Dear All,

Is there any rule that your NE will be cancelled if you work in another EU country (say U.K)for more than six months.
I got an offer to work in U.K. for 4 years .
Is it possible to renew the NE again if it gets cancelled.

Is there any thing regarding this in some new law or an ammendments that may come in future.

Thanks for your replies in advance.

HAVE HOPE

@havehope

"Is there any rule that your NE will be cancelled if you work in another EU country (say U.K)for more than six months.I got an offer to work in U.K. for 4 years .
Is it possible to renew the NE again if it gets cancelled."

there is no law defined yet (as far as i'm aware) for cancelled ne to renew.

"Is there any thing regarding this in some new law or an ammendments that may come in future."

i donot think so, because the ne is issued by default that you are going to stay in germany on long term. but after some years later when you get your citizenship then everything is different as you enjoy eu-wide freedom.

@havehope
Is there any rule that your NE will be cancelled if you work in another EU country (say U.K)for more than six months.

http://aufenthaltstitel.de/aufenthaltsg.html#51

§ 51 Beendigung der Rechtmäßigkeit des Aufenthalts; Fortgeltung von Beschränkungen

(1) Der Aufenthaltstitel erlischt in folgenden Fällen:
7. wenn der Ausländer ausgereist und nicht innerhalb von sechs Monaten oder einer von der Ausländerbehörde bestimmten längeren Frist wieder eingereist ist,

I got an offer to work in U.K. for 4 years. Is it possible to renew the NE again if it gets cancelled.

Yes, it can be renewed, but to do this, you have to come back to Germany and stay 5 years again ;)

havehope writes:
Is there any thing regarding this in some new law or an ammendments that may come in future.

instructor answers:
i donot think so, because the ne is issued by default that you are going to stay in germany on long term. but after some years later when you get your citizenship then everything is different as you enjoy eu-wide freedom.

No, there is a Directive from European Council:

Council Directive 2003/109/EC of 25 November 2003 concerning the status of third-country nationals who are long-term residents
http://europa.eu.int/eur-lex/lex/staging/LexUriServ/LexUriServ.do?uri=OJ:L:2004:016:0044:0053:ENDF (English)

In short, as of 23.01.2006, yesterday , foreign people having NE from Germany can stay in EU countries and work there, as stated in Article 4. Exception is England, Denmark and Ireland:

Council Directive 2003/109/EC of 25 November 2003
http://europa.eu.int/eur-lex/lex/LexUriServ/LexUriServ.do?uri=CELEX:32003L0109:EN:NOT
Additional information:
CNS 2001/0074
Not applicable in United Kingdom
Not applicable in Ireland
Not applicable in Denmark

The German Law above had to be updated according to Directive until 23.01.2006. It's a conflicting situation now. The times taken account in the Directive is compatible to §51 of AufenthG (see Article 4.3) and more conservative (total of 10 months duration of absence!!).

Klenze17.

@Klenze17

"No, there is a Directive from European Council:"

yes, you are right in here. unfortunatly (i think) mr. havehope want to know whether he can do it in his life time (eventhough he meant in future) as we all know in eu how the laws bought into practice. it is not about one country but all member states has to ratify the law in their own states unless there is no objection exist. so someone can say in flat that it is not possible.

Thanks Instructor and Klenze for the advices

@ Klenze
.'' wenn der Ausländer ausgereist und nicht innerhalb von sechs Monaten oder einer von der Ausländerbehörde bestimmten längeren Frist wieder eingereist ist.''

Does this mean that if I come to Germany for a day or 2 evry now and then(atleast once in 6 months). I can maintain my NE.(May be i still maintain my anmeldung).

I mean to ask is there any connection between the status of NE and Tax authorities, as i will not be paying taxex here but in U.K.??

The opinion of ABH employees gathered around info4alien.de is that no, you cannot do that.

The other part of the formulation in the law says also that your NE is invalid IMMEDIATELY if you have left Germany in the case that you are not temporarily leaving the country:


...wenn der Ausländer aus einem seiner Natur nach nicht vorübergehenden Grunde ausreist...

So my personal opinion is that the above condition is definitely fulfilled if:

-> you have cancelled your appartment in germany
-> you have found new job outside germany

On the other hand you must have misfortune that ABH finds out that you have actually left Germany, and that somebody from ABH really wants to make you trouble.

But if and when they find out you are fried because in that case they can even charge your for "illegal entry", and this is very bad. From my sorry experience, yes, once the german institutions caught you they will charge you for maximum extent possible by the law :-( .

if that offer for 4 years comes from your company and return in D is planned than you could try to arrange it with ABH not to lose NE.

but if it is completely another firma and you have to search for job in D after return than no chance.

what you could try is to work in GB as a freelancer based in D and pay some taxes in D and have a flat in D (you can find Untermieter).

and after 2 years and citizenship you are free


@cedo
jeste dobili NE ti i piton

Does this mean that if I come to Germany for a day or 2 evry now and then(atleast once in 6 months). I can maintain my NE.(May be i still maintain my anmeldung).

No, read the Law carefully please!

wenn der Ausländer ausgereist und nicht innerhalb von sechs Monaten oder einer von der Ausländerbehörde bestimmten längeren Frist wieder eingereist ist.

It says that you must come back to Germany within 6 months, after you've been out. That means you must stay at least 6 months in Germany every year! You just can't come for 2 days, otherwise you will lose your NE!

If you leave Germany for long, you will immediately lose your NE. There is no question about it. They haven't done adjustments for 2003/109/EC yet.

Klenze17.

@havehope

so finally most of the posts end up in saying directly or indirectly it is "not possible". why can't you wait another two / three years, get citizenship and leave germany forever as most of people do that? then at the same time you can come back at any time you need.

Thank you all for your advices.
That leaves me with the option to wait for the passport.
Now in my case

Came to Germany in Dec 1998 (Authen halt bewilligung)

2000 Sept got Green card
2005 march got NE

When earliest can i apply for the Citizen ship?
My german is limited to just basics!

"When earliest can i apply for the Citizenship"

Under the given facts, actually now..

Go and do an integration course.. with an integration course you can apply for the citizenship with 7 years.. Some states count the time of Aufenthaltsbewilligung.. Bayern and BW do not count it.. if you are not living one of these states, you have good chances for the citizenship and you can apply for it now..

Regards,

Lacrima

@havehope

what mr. lacrima said was right and it depends case-by-case.

"That leaves me with the option to wait for the passport."

yes, unfortunatly and it is good infact, at the same time you'll have to return your original citizenship, it does not matter where you come from.

"2000 Sept got Green card
2005 march got NE"

i think you've chance to apply for citizenship now. anyway it is quite long process, in any case it cannot be done less than an year. after living in germany from 1998, i'm sure that you've learnt to apply and keep waiting

"When earliest can i apply for the Citizen ship?"

give a try right-now i think you have a chance. just visit one of the office where you can apply for citizenship, get to information and talk to them.

"My german is limited to just basics!"

they will not check your german completly, just they want to know that you understand and can read and explain what that means. after living in germany soo long time, i'm sure that you can do that easily.

Instructor,Lacrima and others,

Thanks for your advices ,I shall do it what you all adviced and see what ABH tells me.

Have hope