Hi all,

one my friend attended an interview around 2 months back. he was immediately appointed. Employer said that it will take around 4-6 weeks to get his permit.

but he did not get a contract nor did he sign or give any of his document to the employer(except the Xerox copy of his passport). upon asking when the company will start processing his permit, he was not given sufficient replies.

now he is really scared and warned the employer(our suggestion) to either process his permit and given him a contract OR he will leave the job... on this the employer has challenged him that if he leaves the job then employer will take legal actions so that my friend cant work in europe.

now, what we are assuring our friend is this--- he did not sign a contract, neither did he get his pay in bank transaction(he was paid cash)...so his employer cant take any legal action against him...we have asked our friend to leave the job as soon as possible...

we are writing this together...so can you share your valuable suggestions and experiences on this...

Thanks in advance
Rohit

Hi Rohit,

Mind telling more about this friend of yours.... like what kind of visa he has, how long he is in germany, where does he hail from, etc.

Hi Akshay,

sure why not!!!

he hails from India(Maharashtra). completed his masters in germany(based on this job offer only he submitted and defended his thesis).

at present he has Job suche visum. he is an IT guy.

Rohit

I am not a law expert, however the situation is like this:

1. According to German laws the employee, not the employer, is responsible for obtaining the residence and work permit

2. Working without workpermit - that is what are you doing now - is not criminal offence (lucky you). The longer you work without WP, the higher will be your fine.

3. Staying in Germany withouth residence permit -that is what are probably also doing currently - is criminal offence. The consequence is: lost of the residence permit in Germany and immediate expulsion, inprisonment is also possible. What kind of RP you have at this very moment ?

4. Receiving the cash payment salary without paying social contributions and tax is also criminal offence, for both you and your employer.

The smartest action now is to leave this company immediately. Otherwise you will sink deeper and deeper.

Is there any proof or witnesses that he payed you some money ?

This is quite complicated stuff and best way would be to involve lawyer.

Hi

he says that there is no proof that he was given payment in cash...as he did not sign anything...
he did not sign a contract, did not give a document and there is no proof in written that employer and he was involved in any kind of relationship...

so can his employer sue him if he leaves the job...

thanx for your quick reply.

Rohit

at present he has Job suche visum. he is an IT guy.

Thats wonderful, that means he can legally stay in germany for 1 year, even after fighting with his employer. What he can do is very simple:

He can simply walk down to the nearest Polizeiwache and starts claiming awakening of his conscience (enlightenment or whatever), he then surrenders himself upon holy authority and confesses how his employer tormented his soul by forcing him to do schwarzarbeit (viz without contract or permit).

His employer stands a fair opportunity to be a honored guest of state(free food/lodging) upto 3 years :-)

http://www.aufenthaltstitel.de/schwarzarbg.html#10

hey thanx for the sugeestion...but we are suggesting him to just walk out of the office...deleting everything(his personal records and file) from his desktop...

so what he fears is...whether his employer can file any legal case on him...

akshay...your method can be suicidal...and he doesnt wants to go to police first...

we want to know what his employer can do against him???

RohitK

@RohitK

"but he did not get a contract nor did he sign or give any of his document to the employer"

Very bad.

This is very naive and it could costs your friend a lot of problems.

Well, he could start doing what he should have done from beginning: Asking his "employer" the contract to be signed. NOW. (don't forget that without a signed contract for both parts there are no way to get any work permit).

If his employer does not give him during the day (he should have it already done or if that not the case, they have templates which normally require only some small changes. So, there aren't excuses from him to delay the signing of the contract), that means that his "employer" is clearly playing with your friend.

Try that and post here what happens. He should do that NOW.

Good luck!

Alex

we want to know what his employer can do against him???

Well :-)...his employer can go to police saying that he hired a guy who claimed to have valid workpermit( since he lost his WP and passport somewhere and is waiting for a new passport, that is why he couldnt see his WP) but infect is working illegally in his company :-)

For your friend in this case, as cedomir puts it: loss of the residence permit in Germany and immediate expulsion, inprisonment is also possible.

so what he fears is...whether his employer can file any legal case on him...

Usually there is every possibility for the employer to create a false case. I think it is better to take a suggestion from VPMK lawyer (I think €120 would be consultation cost) instead of just guessing what might happen. If not, ask your friend just to leave the premesis and wait for a letter from employer's attorney and then go to lawyer. You should also consider what motivates employer to file a case against your friend because it is illegal for employer to hire someone without WP? If he file a case then he is also asking for trouble so my guess is he is just threatening and not being committed strongly to take your friend to the court.


akshay...your method can be suicidal...and he doesnt wants to go to police first...

of course it is suicidal. First choice of police is meant to be for criminal cases not of this type. Lawyer is always good and an easy option. Beware some lawyers might be getting you in trouble so take VPMK lawyers. They are damn good and committed!

hey thanks for the replies...

what is a VPMK lawyer...

and my friend(who did not go to the office today, really scared) is asking about one more possibility...

what if he lies to them saying that he is going back to india for a month and will be back in feb...and then let the things dry up...

then later in feb , he will inform them that only with a contract he can work(he swears not to wok with them any more)...

what do you say on this...

Rohit

what is a VPMK lawyer...

They are suggested by the Trust7 board and are helping solve many visa cases for foreigners in Germany. You can contact them through trust7 or directly http://www.vpmk.de

and my friend(who did not go to the office today, really scared) is asking about one more possibility...

what if he lies to them saying that he is going back to india for a month and will be back in feb...and then let the things dry up...

then later in feb , he will inform them that only with a contract he can work(he swears not to wok with them any more)...

not bad! but it only solves your problem for sometime but lawyer could take you on the legal front.

I do not understand (could not find in previous messages) what connects this guy to company.

- He doesn't have contract
- He did not get any money (at least not legaly)

Does he has some email from employer about complete situation?

When he will get hois passport with Visa?
If somebody wants to check status of Visa this is not a problem in Germany so this is not excuse for company.
Even if company "says" that he said that he has a Visa and he doesn't have they HAD to give him contract or they are not in any relation.

Legally there is nothing between and company.
As long as he is afraid to do something and plays under his employer rules they will abuse him.

So again point is to be on the safe side contact Trust7 laywers but I will not be afraid of this employer because there is nothing between them.

This is what my friends says too....there is nothing between him and his employer...no legal necessity for any one of them to state...

even the payment was paid in cash...no invoices...no receipts...there is not even a single document where he signed(he is confident)...

so on what behalf can his employer atleast prove that he worked for them...and what can his employer do(becoz he will also be in trouble for employing a guy without contract, we say this)...

and even if he meet lawyers what is he going to tell him/her...and what is the lawyer going to do...file a case against employer(which we feel wont be good)...

and even if he meet lawyers what is he going to tell him/her...and what is the lawyer going to do...file a case against employer(which we feel wont be good)

that's a good question. Lawyer will be handy to give you some precautions of what he know as a professional. May be he will suggest you to be quite but again he can put you in the right path.